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So - How Do You Diagnose Front End Issues...

2.5K views 9 replies 4 participants last post by  SteveTheBluesman  
#1 ·
Hi Everyone ~

99 Se Vulcan, 106k.

What is the procedure for testing the front end? Jack up the car and pull on the wheel top and bottom & side to side? What tests what? How much play is normal?

Car is making intermittent high pitched moaning and groaning noises when moving like something is dried out - I am trying to figure out what.

(I am doing the turkey baster power steering fluid change - but since the noise doesn't happen when the car is standing still, I don't think it is the power steering.)

Also, I was thinking of trying to grease the front end that may be dried out - but I don't think there are any grease fittings. Are there any areas in the front end that would benefit from some grease?

Anyway, any thoughts are appreciated...I tell you, without this site, I would have given up on this piece of **** car a long time ago.
 
#2 ·
pulling on the wheel:
at 12 and 6 you are testing for bad ball joints
at 3 and 9 you are testing for bad tie rods

if you notice any significant play, or clunks, it can be other issues, but it will lead you in the right direction.

The squealing leads me to think you probably have a bad bearing.
 
#3 ·
As spridget said, check the ball joints and tie rods like that... you should not have ANY play.. if you do, something needs to be replaced. "High-pitched" and "moaning and groaning" don't really go together... to me, a groan is a lower pitched noise.. high-pitched would be a whistle or squeal. Which do you have? I agree with spridget... if it's a lower pitched noise like a rumble, it's likely a wheel bearing. If it's a squealing noise when you turn the steering, it's likely a tie rod end or a ball joint. And no, there are no grease fittings on any factory front end parts. The only way to get grease fittings is to replace the OEM parts with aftermarket that have fittings.

Also check your sway bar link ends... they clunk a lot when worn out. The easiest way is to be driving slowly and crank the steering back and forth to shift the weight of the car. If you hear a clunk as the weight shifts, you likely have a bad stab link end. To pinpoint which one, park the car and turn the steering all the way to one side. Then reach in behind the wheel on one side and grab the bottom of the stab link end where it joins the stab link, and rock the car back and forth. There should be no movement between the stab link itself and the stab link end. Do the same thing again while holding the top of the link end, then turn the steering wheel the other way, and check the other side. I use this procedure all the time in the shop, and it works very well for me.
 
#4 ·
Hmmm, how to describe the noise...

It is not a wheel bearing rumble, not even close. But it is not whistling either.

It sounds like a washing machine that is about to throw a belt. The best way I could desribe it is an intermittent dried out friction sound. Sometimes it is 3 seconds, other times it is 10 seconds, it is never constant, and it will go away with a very slight turn of the wheel.

My wife counted the seconds on her 30 minute drive...it made the noise for about 60 seconds during that time. (I recall the bearing noise as constantly rumbling before it **** the bed.)

I will check the tie rods and ball joints as described above. How about CV joints - could one of the boots have dried out?
 
#5 ·
If it sounds like something quealing along with what was already mentioned. You could check the backing shield on the rotors. It's not the proper name I know, but I can't think of it right now. If something hit it or somehow bent it in slightly it could be rubbing on the rotor causing the noise. I've done it myself after changing my front pads. You just have to push it away from the rotor and the noise will stop. That is, if this is your problem.
 
#6 ·
The pie tin on the rotors...I had that one before too, but that isn't it :)

The noise came to me last night. It sounds like when you blow in an empty jug.

Anyway, I have found I have the chocolate milk burnt PS fluid, and I am using the turkey baster method for the last couple of days - wife says the frequency of the noises are much less.

Coincidence?
 
#7 ·
does it moan all the time, or only when you turn the wheel?

PS pumps will begin to moan when something is wrong (ie air in the system, burnt fluid, worn pump). They usually moan when the wheel is turned and make no noise when the wheels are straight. If it moans all the time, that usually a sign of a bigger issue (bad leak or worn out pump).

Continue with the turkey baster and lets us know if it helps.
 
#8 ·
Spridget, 1st I want to say thanks for sticking with me on this thread...

No, it does not make the noise all the time. In a 30 minute drive it will moan/howl only between 30 seconds to a minute and a half. That's all.

It usually happens when the wheel is turned slightly, and goes away when brought back to straight.

I am beginning to get my hopes up that it only needed the fluid changed. I will continue turkey basting every day for another week, and I will see if I can pick up some Lucas additive as well.

Thanks again.
 
#9 ·
I think changing the fluid will help... basically it will prolong the inevitable, which is going to be a new PS pump.... and pray to the Car Gods, that you won't need a new rack. Fortunately, pumps aren't too expensive and fairly easy to replace. I'd say you'll get by until the temps start climbing... around summer time.
 
#10 ·
I wanted to follow up on this...

I finally brought the car in, since the noise got worse.

Turns out that the right rear brake was intermittently grabbing...turns out that I just THOUGHT I was able to completely free the frozen caliper bolt. Double idiot points for not replacing the gouged rotor (I only sanded it.) So, this combination led to the intermittent high pitched howling.

Not a bearing. Not the steering rack. But my own Mickey Mouse repair.

Well, new rotor, new set of pads, and a caliper braket...mechanic charging me $150.

Sometimes Mickey Mouse bites you in the ass.