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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I always thought that dealerships saved all the castings (like water pumps, brake calipers, etc.) they took off of serviced vehicles and returned them to the car manufacturer for a few dollars each to become the rebuilt units we buy at the auto stores. When I worked at Ford I remember we had a station for rebuilding water pumps. Recently I had my car serviced and I asked the service manager to save the old master cylinder. He told me "Oops, it got thrown in the trash".
 

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I always thought that dealerships saved all the castings (like water pumps, brake calipers, etc.) they took off of serviced vehicles and returned them to the car manufacturer for a few dollars each to become the rebuilt units we buy at the auto stores. When I worked at Ford I remember we had a station for rebuilding water pumps. Recently I had my car serviced and I asked the service manager to save the old master cylinder. He told me "Oops, it got thrown in the trash".
I don't know what state you are in, but in a lot of states it is the law that if you request the parts they are required to return them to you (except for warranty and exchange).

New York for example:
NYS DMV - (Brochure) Know Your Rights in Auto Repair

If I were you, I'd look into it for your state and then go down there and make sure the service manager makes it right...I know it's not the same, but I had a bicycle recently serviced where they accidentally threw away the bottom bracket (road bike, $125 bottom bracket) until I asked to speak to the manager and they magically 'found' the bottom bracket and the manager knocked 20% off my labor fees for my troubles.

In my state (MN) they are legally allowed to charge you a fee for the old parts, but they have to have the parts available to you for 5 days for you to inspect any parts that were replaced.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
I live in Ohio.

I didn't think there was anything wrong with my old master cylinder. Except for that pinched front brake hose, my brakes were perfect as far as I could tell before the brake lines rusted through. I sure got problems now though!!! The pedal is sinking to the floor, and the new reservoir is leaking profusely at the cap. Two independent problems on a brand new master cylinder. What are the odds?

See my full story at: Ford Taurus Forum • '99 Taurus Brakes Won't Bleed?????????????????? - Ford Taurus Forum which includes a link to continuing discussion on this forum.

I don't think they can charge me for the old part in this case because the new part was priced without a core exchange requirement.
 

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In NY they have to return your parts to you if you ask them to BEFORE they start the work, like when you drop off the car. This goes for cats too, which you can get some money for at a metal salvage yard. If the reservoir is leaking at the cap, the new master sounds either bad or blocked.
 

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In NY they have to return your parts to you if you ask them to BEFORE they start the work, like when you drop off the car. This goes for cats too, which you can get some money for at a metal salvage yard. If the reservoir is leaking at the cap, the new master sounds either bad or blocked.
Hey dan, I agree with you on the point that they have to return the parts, but they can also charge you for parts that they say have a core charge on. YES they have to show them to you also, but in the example of the cats, they can say there is a $100 core charge you have to pay if you want to take it.

Here in Ohio, they are required by law to show you the parts and if there is not a core charge they must offer you the parts to take home. I dont know how long they have to keep them after you pick up your car, but you can find out i'm sure. Again, in Ohio the only time they DONT have to show you the parts is if it is a warranty repair that you dont have to pay for. The one exception, if you have a deductable then they have to show the parts. Its enough to drive you crazy finding out what they can and cant do or have to do with old parts.
 

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Here in NY they can't charge you a core if you can prove you can buy the part without a core (like a cat). Not hard to do.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
Here in Ohio, they are required by law to show you the parts and if there is not a core charge they must offer you the parts to take home.
If they're open I'm going down there tomorrow! It is much more agregious than that if you read my full story.

Here's some of it:
The next morning I get a call that my master cylinder is blown. I guess that would mean that a seal on one of the pistons is just gone. He wants to sell me a new original Ford M/C for $160. I find a new M/C (complete with reservoir) at Advance Auto for $65 and reluctantly ask if he can pick it up at Advance (less than 1 mile away from him) because it is too cold outside for the bad fuel pump on my truck. I tell him to be sure and save me the old M/C and he agrees to save it for me. He warns me that by not using genuine Ford parts, that he would not be able to guarantee it. I’ve never had a problem with parts from Advance or any of the other parts stores before, so I don’t see why there should be a problem now.

Thursday – no call from Ford. Friday – no call from Ford. Don’t these guys usually call you as soon as (or even before) they finish to impress you with their speedy service? Finally, I call them at 2:00pm on Friday because I had arranged my brother-in-law to drive half-way across the county (direct from work) to help me pick up my car (my truck has bad fuel pump). He says my car is ready to go. So I pick up my car and the $65 brake bleeding contract has now ballooned to $250! Not much grounds for me to argue though, with him having to replace that (supposedly) bad M/C (and pick up the new one for me). I ask to have the old M/C and he just says: “It probably got thrown out.” After I press the issue, he walks to the other end of the shop for a couple minutes, and returns to say that he is sorry, but the trash collector already came earlier that day. How convenient! Even if there was no agreement to return it to me, don’t they save these things to return to the manufacturer for core value? My brother-in-law drops me off at home, and my wife is happy to have her Taurus back for the first time in over a month. On the way home I realize that they didn’t give me the receipt from Advance Auto. Isn’t that strange! Without it I have no lifetime warranty.
How will I know if they give me the master cylinder from my car? Anybody know what markings would appear on the original Ford item for a 1999 Taurus w/ 3.0L 24 Valve engine?
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Saturday April 9, I talked to the owner at the Ford dealership. He would not offer his name.

1) He said it was their policy to call customers as soon as possible following service. For three days after the service was performed (according to invoice) we patiently waited for the call. He said sometimes they can't always get through with cell phones. (mine is a land phone) I finally called them. (Then the excuse that it was hauled away in the trash. How convenient!)

2) I asked why I was charged for a full can of brake cleaner. He said they don't steam clean anymore. They would have used it to clean around the master cylinder. Sounds far fetched to me, but possible.

3) I told him that I had asked Jerry to save me the old master cylinder. He said they usualy try to show the old parts to the customer. He said their dumpsters are emptied every Monday, and that with my part already gone there was nothing he could do. ("Monday" would have been 3 days after I picked up my car) When I told him about Jerry telling me the trash had already been hauled away on Friday, he said Jerry must have meant that it had been carried out to the dumpster.

4) I remindeed him that state law requires that I am allowed to examine it. He said there are a lot of exceptions to this law. When I pushed the issue he tried to rationalize why it would be of no use to me.

5) I asked about the $89 charge for a $63.95 retail (new) master cylinder. He had to pick it up 1 mile away. I thought this should have been broken out into parts + labor. Except for transit time, they would have waited as long for the part through their own parts department.

6) I told him there were other problems with the car that would have to be addressed once I finished researching the possible causes. He said with the pedal dropping to the floor (the reason I took the car there) there can only be two possible explanations: "Either there is a problem with the master cylinder, or with the brake lines." I did not explain the current problems. I said: "Given that Jerry had already deceived me about the old master cylinder, I was justifiably concerned that Jerry could be trusted to deal with me honestly."

7) When I left I reminded him that if the law required them to allow me 5 days to examine the part, then they could not have legally allowed it to be hauled away 3 days after I picked up my car (and it would still be there somewhere). I said Jerry should try to find it before I call back, otherwise I would have my attorney contact them. He said he always keeps one on retainer.
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Two inches of pedal travel, then the pedal eventually stops slowly sinking just before touching the floor with my leg nearly straight. I need to know if there is anything else at all that could cause these symptoms because this guy is going to screw me over big time if I don't know everything there is to know about this.

This car has 4-wheel ABS. I bet he'll want to replace the HCU or the booster and soak me for that.

Does the law allow me to have it fixed somewhere else? Or watch them? I just don't trust them at all. How would I find a copy of this law?
 
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