R-134a

6312 Views 23 Replies 15 Participants Last post by diesel600, May 31, 2004

UnDeR EsTiMaTeD

Discussion Starter · May 2, 2004

My A/C is currently blowing hot air, so I decided I'd buy one of those R-134a cans and put it in. Put for some reason, I could get it on the service port (by the radiator) and it sprayed all over and I wasted the can. How in the heck does that thing snap on? No matter how hard I tried, it did not connect properly on the service port. I thought I was going to break my wrist. Any ideas on this? How do I attach that can?

1 - 20 of 24 Posts

sundarpn

· #2 · May 2, 2004

I am told that is it very risk to handle that freon. I can cause blindness etc etc.... :blink:
is it so risk? Ofcourse I know its illegal to let it out.. but is it a hazard or posionous to us.. if we are exposed

I was pretty attracted to that r134a recharge can at walmart.. it comes with a gauge too

93taurusSX

· #3 · May 2, 2004

You sure you have an AC system that is suppposed to be r-134a? I know that the valves and stuff between the old r12 and r134a's were made different on purpose so that people wouldn't put one type of refridgerant into a system meant for hte other type?

ron porter

· #4 · May 2, 2004

Originally posted by UnDeR EsTiMaTeD@May 1 2004, 10:01 PM
My A/C is currently blowing hot air, so I decided I'd buy one of those R-134a cans and put it in. Put for some reason, I could get it on the service port (by the radiator) and it sprayed all over and I wasted the can. How in the heck does that thing snap on? No matter how hard I tried, it did not connect properly on the service port. I thought I was going to break my wrist. Any ideas on this? How do I attach that can?

a/c systems are not my forte, and I absolutely can't say for certain on your car (nor, for that matter, on my '94) , but on the Gen 3 SHO, the R134 needs to be put in the service port on the low-pressure side, which is back by the firewall, not the high-pressure port near the front.

This is why I pay people to do this......possible to screw up the car and/or yourself if you aren't careful!!

henrysel

· #5 · May 2, 2004

I don't know about your particular model, but on the AC stuff, the low pressure side is usually the bigger valve, the high pressure is the smaller valve and as mentioned earlier, you want to put it in on the low presssure side.

You should have the AC on when adding the can. I'd have the can right side up first, then once you have it connected, you can flip over the can and it'll suck it right in although I've known people to just leave the can upright and let it take it's time going in. It might be less dangerous that way as I suppose things could happen if the system was already full and you overcharged it.

There's typically some sight glass somewhere that will show bubbles if it's not full. If it's completely hot air, everything could have leaked out over the winter and it would probably take 2-3 cans to completely fill it up although when this used to happen to me, I'd just put one or two cans in until it got hot again. Of course once the leak got pretty bad and it didn't last more than a few weeks, I finally got it fixed and it was fine after that.

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godspunk32

· #6 · May 2, 2004

Originally posted by sundarpn@May 1 2004, 10:10 PM
I am told that is it very risk to handle that freon. I can cause blindness etc etc.... :blink:
is it so risk? Ofcourse I know its illegal to let it out.. but is it a hazard or posionous to us.. if we are exposed

I was pretty attracted to that r134a recharge can at walmart.. it comes with a gauge too

Freon and R-134a are two completely different gases, although they do achieve the same thing in the end. The difference between them is their impact on the environment. Freon is relatively toxic, whereas R-134a is much safer. Freon and R-134a based systems operate differently, albeit according to the same principles, therefore, they are not interchangable. It is also illegal in many states to sell or buy Freon, unless you have a special permit, which is very difficult to obtain. The environmentalist wackos don't want us to have anything in our cars that might hurt the "gray horned, spotted, crested, duck-billed, clawed owl"...

Anyways...getting away from my editorial rant and back to refridgerants. The use of R-134a instead of Freon was made mandatory in 1995 or so. Older cars might have freon based systems, whereas newer cars obviously have R-134a based systems. You need to check your manual to determine what type of system you have before you try to put it in. If you put the wrong type in, you may damage the system. If you have a R-134a system, all you need to do is read the directions and put the stuff in. If you have a freon system, then you will need to go to a shop that will recharge it, because you won't be able to buy it and put it in yourself (it comes in a bottle that looks very much like a propane bottle).

JR

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sundarpn

· #7 · May 2, 2004

Mine is a 1996 GL (gen3)... its r134a...
Its cools pretty good. How can I check that its full? Is there a sight glass?

jj57

· #8 · May 2, 2004

YOU WERE VERY LUCKY!!!!

That connector is the High Side, NEVER Connect a can to the high side, it will become a Grenade.

The Low side service port is in the back by the firewall.

diesel600

· #9 · May 2, 2004

Originally posted by godspunk32@May 2 2004, 01:41 AM
The environmentalist wackos don't want us to have anything in our cars that might hurt the "gray horned, spotted, crested, duck-billed, clawed owl"...

Umm not exactly, would you want your grandkids to have to wear SPF 1000 sunblock every day when there's no more ozone layer?

That was the problem with R-12. Other than that R-12 was pretty harmless unless you burned it, in which case a combustion by-product was pretty toxic.

biteableniles

· #10 · May 2, 2004

Seriously getting back on topic...

I'm going to be replacing the compressor on my girlfriend's explorer (blown seal). Should I just get an AC place to flush it and fill it, or could i get a flush/refill kit myself with minimal difficulty? I've been kinda scared about the R-134a bottles because they are high pressure, and it's difficult to tell how full the AC system is (or if it's overfilled.)

UnDeR EsTiMaTeD, when I played with on of the bottles, locked onto the AC port, and then the other end of the hose screwed onto the bottle, and a little screw would puncture the lid and transfer the coolant between the bottle and the AC system. I didn't have a problem connecting anything...if you are sure you were on the right port, i would suggest picking up another bottle and seeing if the hose was messed up.

diesel600

· #11 · May 3, 2004

If you are replacing a compressor, you'll probably need to take it to a shop, unless you have a vacuum pump. Whenever the system is opened for any reason (such as replacing parts, or when all the refrigerant leaks out), vacuum needs to be applied to the system for a good half hour at least to remove all the moisture from the system. You'll probably want to replace the accumulator too.

I have used the bottles of R134a before. They are not any more dangerous than any other aerosol can. Just add it slowly with a/c on full blast and monitor the temperature at the vents. However, gauges work best to monitor the charge. A good set of gauges runs about $75 at Advance where I live, but I have been seeing cheaper gauges, some are bottle/gauge combinations, that probably work well enough.

DMX

· #12 · May 3, 2004

You've got the 3.8, the low side port (the one you want) is back near the firewall on that rub coming out of that can thing. The high pressure side is right much closer to the radiator.

With that said, if your system is down THAT low, you simply may not have enough pressure to overcome the low pressure cutoff point, the compressor will refuse to engage and the can contents will not be sucked into the system, you can force it to activate by removing the plug on the tall can by the firewall next to the low side port, and jumpering the two points on the plug itself (paperclip or something). I woudlnt do it for a long time though, maybe just enough to get a can or two sucked in. I'd advice grabbing one of the pressure guages you can find in the same area you found the R134, dont want to overcharge and hurt something. If you leak it all out again then there is obviously something wrong with a hardline or seal somewhere and throwing can after can at it wont help :-( Good luck man.

Dont forget to reconnect the plug so the system and work properly.

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spridget

· #13 · May 4, 2004

R134a and R12 are not interchangeable.... however, I have "retro fitted" several cars in the past from R12 to R134a and have not had a problem. The two refrigerants operate at different pressures, R134a operates at a lower pressure IIRC.

If you are adding R134a to a R12 system (which I suspect you are based on the year of your car) I suggest getting the retro fit kit. It's available at WalMart and AutoZone. It provides you with the necessary connectors and detailed instructions. It also usually includes a pressure gauge to ensure your are not overfilling the system.

Technically, It is not recommended unless your car has all the required changes, but I have used it in an '85 Honda and an '88 Honda both of which have R12 systems and it worked.....

diesel600

· #14 · May 4, 2004

He has a '94, so he would not be retrofitting. All '94 and newer came with R134a from the factory.

Racer X

· #15 · May 4, 2004

Just an FYI for everyone interested:

Prolonged exposure to R-134a vapors (like when a can or two or a few vents itself and you breathe the vapors in) has been proven to cause testicular cancer. :blink:

That means that they have to cut your nuts off.

One can won't do it, since this is more like an occupational hazard kinda thing, but all the same, be careful with that stuff, ok man?

jj57

· #16 · May 4, 2004

R-134a operates at a Higher Pressure than R-12. And Both Service ports are different sizes to prevent accidents.

As mentioned before, a good set of Manifold gauges with proper high and low side readings are very useful charging. The tolerances for 134a are very tight as opposed to the old R-12 systems.

Also remember to get POE (ester) oil if required, Not PAG oil.

diesel600

· #17 · May 4, 2004

Originally posted by Racer X@May 4 2004, 11:56 AM
Just an FYI for everyone interested:

Prolonged exposure to R-134a vapors (like when a can or two or a few vents itself and you breathe the vapors in) has been proven to cause testicular cancer. :blink:

That means that they have to cut your nuts off.

One can won't do it, since this is more like an occupational hazard kinda thing, but all the same, be careful with that stuff, ok man?

Are you sure about that? That's news to me. Got any references?

This is what I've always been told...

In evaluations done by the chemical industry R134a has been found to be safe and to pose no cancer or birth defect hazards.

Got that from here: http://www.delanet.com/~pparish/refrig.htm

sixfofalcon

· #18 · May 4, 2004

I knew a kid in high school who huffed R-12 pretty regularly.

:blink:

h34r:

diesel600

· #19 · May 4, 2004

R-12 is nontoxic too. The only way you could get "high" off it would be from lack of oxygen, since you are breathing the R-12 instead of oxygen. When R-12 first came out one of the demonstrations they did with it was have a guy breath it to show how safe it was.

UnDeR EsTiMaTeD

Discussion Starter · #20 · May 5, 2004

Originally posted by DMX@May 2 2004, 07:02 PM
You've got the 3.8, the low side port (the one you want) is back near the firewall on that rub coming out of that can thing. The high pressure side is right much closer to the radiator.

With that said, if your system is down THAT low, you simply may not have enough pressure to overcome the low pressure cutoff point, the compressor will refuse to engage and the can contents will not be sucked into the system, you can force it to activate by removing the plug on the tall can by the firewall next to the low side port, and jumpering the two points on the plug itself (paperclip or something). I woudlnt do it for a long time though, maybe just enough to get a can or two sucked in. I'd advice grabbing one of the pressure guages you can find in the same area you found the R134, dont want to overcharge and hurt something. If you leak it all out again then there is obviously something wrong with a hardline or seal somewhere and throwing can after can at it wont help :-( Good luck man.

Dont forget to reconnect the plug so the system and work properly.

Well, when I turn on my A/C it makes a deep groaning noise. I'll look for the other connector near the firewall.

I also have one of the gauges to make sure I don't overcharge the system.

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