Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum banner

1 - 17 of 17 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
When the code first appeared (when I first bought the car), at the advise of this thread and this thread, I changed the DPFE sensor. I cleared the code, and it came back with a sh*tload of its buddies when I realized my gas tank was crap. I have since replaced the tank and fuel pump, and ran the car for a couple of days. Guess who is back to join us.

When I first crank the car, it has a little bit of a rough idle. Otherwise, I cannot tell that anything is wrong with this car. I have not ran a full tank of gas through this car with it properly running to be able to tell what the mileage should be, so I cannot tell you if the gas mileage is affected.

Work that I have done that can be possibly eliminated from my "where to start" list: I've replaced the oxygen sensor, camshaft position sensor, camshaft position synchronizer, spark plugs, spark plug wires, battery groundwire cable, and DPFE sensor.

Okay folks, where to next? :dunno:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14,126 Posts
Well DTC 411 is the Secondary Air Injection, nothing to do with the DPFEgr or the gas tank.

Do you have a California car? If not you probably don't even have the SAI.

Here's the label to look for. It's under the hood and pay attention to the letters in the lower right hand corner of it.
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
Well DTC 411 is the Secondary Air Injection, nothing to do with the DPFEgr or the gas tank.
[/b]
I guess the DPFE was more for the P0402 than the P0411. I doubt that the fuel had anything to with the code, but a lot of codes came up when the fuel tank was full of crap. I just didn't want to duplicate any work I had already done.

Do you have a California car? If not you probably don't even have the SAI.

Here's the label to look for. It's under the hood and pay attention to the letters in the lower right hand corner of it.
[/b]

hmm... I looked for the sticker. There's no sticker under my hood. (Pics under hood)







However, there is a sticker in my passenger side rear seat little window that says "Proudly manufactured in Atlanta, Georgia". Doesn't the VIN also tell you where it was manufactured? Would it tell you if you have a California car? Even still, how do I fix this problem of P0411?

I found this thread that suggests it is either the diverter valve or the SSR at the pump has failed. Where do I start with this?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
834 Posts
I typed the information in that link from the Hayne's Repair Manual...based off this part:
"The PCM-controlled vacuum solenoid supplies manifold vacuum to the diverter valves. With high vacuum, the diverter valves direct air to the exhaust. With no vacuum at the diverter valves, the built-in check valves close to keep exhaust from flowing back to the air injection system."....I would think maybe the built-in check vavle in one of the diverter valves has failed and isn't closing all the way....But someone else correct me if I'm wrong...since he doesn't live in California...couldn't he just disable that system. I was under the impression that SAI was only a CA requirement?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #5
Found a piece of a Ford manual that addresses the P0411. Looks like it could be the pump, the diverter, or even leaves in my silencer (which I was going to cut anyway). See page 16 to see that bugs or leaves in the silencer can cause the P0411: http://taurus-club.ru/incoming/ACE%20-%2010000.pdf
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,492 Posts
Your looking in the wrong places. Its Literally Under the hood. Its ON the hood itself.






Unless the previous owner took them off. And IIRC that's illegal in certain states.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
I have a picture of the underside of the hood. I looked on the hood itself. There are no stickers.

Thanks for the post, but none of those stickers are on my hood. I had my hood painted due to rust and they probably took all the stickers off to paint it.

:dunno:
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14,126 Posts
Your car had been wrecked or at least the hood repainted or replaced.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
Your car had been wrecked or at least the hood repainted or replaced.
[/b]
Yeah, I just said that I had the hood repainted. This car is from the north and I had some rust on the hood. I had the hood and roof of the car repainted. So, are there any pictures of the parts that I should be looking for?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14,126 Posts
I'm not sure if the Vulcan came with a mechanical pump or not. The manual only references the electric pump. If that is the case more than likely the relay is bad. The electric pump and relay are on the front left corner of the subframe straight under the battery. There is a 30A fuse under the hood labeled Thermactor Pump.

Many threads on this with pics.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #11
Looks like I'm in the same shape as this post: http://www.taurusclub.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=48940

So I'll try to go from here.


What seems most likely with many P0411 OBD II code is that the Air Diverter mechanism is "stuck". Lucky for us it is BURIED near the transmission range (TR) switch, underneath the throttle body with several metal tubes running over it (HOORAY!). You can't just take inlet tube to the Air Diverter off with your hands or even pry its seal loose with a long screwdriver. HAHA! You're gonna have to take a bunch of equipment off if you want to see if this baby is getting air to the Diverter Valve. Then, you will have to put most of that equipment back I imagine to get the results. HAHA! You didn't know Marquis De Sade was on the Ford Engineering Team, silly You.

Since this is literally the "Fresh air doorway" I imagine that soot gums up the door (it is connected to the exhaust system) thus rendering it useless until it is cleaned or replaced. I need a little, tiny chimney sweep.

Oh, the "picture/document" IS the HM 7 procedure mentioned from the V8SHO.com site. Many people will suggest these things but not in an organized manner that allows you to more easily troubleshoot your problem. I would save it if I had access to it here and did not have it otherwise.
[/b]

It's most likely the SAI relay, bolted onto the side of the pump. The pump is located on the subframe, directly below the battery. It's accessible from underneath the car - remove the driver's side tire and the inner fenders and splash shield under the front bumper and you'll see it right nest to the driver's side front subframe bushing.

The relay can be replaced without lowering the subframe at all, but it requires long skinny fingers.
[/b]
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
10,022 Posts
Looks like I'm in the same shape as this post: http://www.taurusclub.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=48940

So I'll try to go from here.


<div class='quotemain'>
What seems most likely with many P0411 OBD II code is that the Air Diverter mechanism is "stuck". Lucky for us it is BURIED near the transmission range (TR) switch, underneath the throttle body with several metal tubes running over it (HOORAY!). You can't just take inlet tube to the Air Diverter off with your hands or even pry its seal loose with a long screwdriver. HAHA! You're gonna have to take a bunch of equipment off if you want to see if this baby is getting air to the Diverter Valve. Then, you will have to put most of that equipment back I imagine to get the results. HAHA! You didn't know Marquis De Sade was on the Ford Engineering Team, silly You.

Since this is literally the "Fresh air doorway" I imagine that soot gums up the door (it is connected to the exhaust system) thus rendering it useless until it is cleaned or replaced. I need a little, tiny chimney sweep.

Oh, the "picture/document" IS the HM 7 procedure mentioned from the V8SHO.com site. Many people will suggest these things but not in an organized manner that allows you to more easily troubleshoot your problem. I would save it if I had access to it here and did not have it otherwise.
[/b]

It's most likely the SAI relay, bolted onto the side of the pump. The pump is located on the subframe, directly below the battery. It's accessible from underneath the car - remove the driver's side tire and the inner fenders and splash shield under the front bumper and you'll see it right nest to the driver's side front subframe bushing.

The relay can be replaced without lowering the subframe at all, but it requires long skinny fingers.
[/b]
[/b][/quote]

...which is exactly what SHOZ123 told you several posts above. :thumb:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #13
Turns out that I have a California car. One of the two hoses is cut that come from the smog pump. That could be the cause of the code. In any case, I got the smog pump from the junk yard today and now I have to figure out where the hose that is cut goes.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14,126 Posts
One of the hoses is just a short 90 degree hose. It is the pump air intake.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
14,126 Posts
Yes it just hangs down on the front of the pump and subframe.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,492 Posts
A little off topic.. but.. I LOVE NOT HAVING SMOG REGS!!!! :banana:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
887 Posts
Discussion Starter #17
A little off topic.. but.. I LOVE NOT HAVING SMOG REGS!!!! :banana:
[/b]
That's the joy of this particular problem. I don't have to have the smog stuff in my car either, but in Louisiana if you're check engine light is on, you can't get an inspection sticker. :angry:
 
1 - 17 of 17 Posts
Top