i seen the turbo kit from STS an was wondering bout it. it really dont have lag since its a rear mounted turbo an when you turn the car on the exhaust helps spin the turbo so since more flow from the exhaust is made the more spin an no lag but how easy is this to do yourself?
new turbo option
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Joined
·
2,492 Posts
To be put simply, No.
It's not something for the typical backyard mechanic as it results in a lot of modification for it to work properly and is expensive. With the amount of work put into it you also need a proper tuning and computer to properly meter the airflow in order to prevent running lean which will destroy your motor.
So unless you have the ability to fabricate your own exhaust and intake piping along with welding experience, in addition to how to properly setup a secondary oil pump and return and can properly re-tune the vehicle and have a AFR computing solution available... Then I wouldn't recommend you DIY.
There was someone a while back who did this to their G4.. they ended up taking it off because it ran lean under WOT and they couldn't get it to run properly.
Joined
·
671 Posts
Also, I don't understand why you think it won't lag. A properly sized turbo won't lag *much* no matter where it's mounted, while a big turbo will always lag. I would honestly wait until Tom Morana finishes his transverse-mount 3.0 supercharger kit. Either way, you're looking at thousands of dollars.
the exhaust powers the turbo from the vids on youtube from the tv series trucks or somethin like that. the more you push on the pedal for more exhaust flow the more it spins the turbo. i think the turbo an exhaust is contected together since your intake is in the rear too. an the kit comes with the oil pump.
Joined
·
671 Posts
I don't want to insult you by explaining a turbo, but what I'm getting from your posts is that you're new to FI. The whole concept of a turbo is that it's exhaust powered, VS pulley powered like a supercharger. That's why it's considered free power. Air compresses, and the more pipe you have between the exhaust valve and the turbo, the more area you have to compress gas. This means that it will take longer to build enough pressure in the exhaust system to spin the turbine, aka increased lag. The STS turbos are designed to reduce turbo lag at it's mounting position, but I'd assume (I don't really have proof) that it's a trade-off of higher RPM flow through the exhaust, similar to the restrictions of using a smaller turbo.
I'm all for forced induction, but I just think people should know what a turbo is before they go duct-taping one to the underside of their muffler.
im not a whole lot up on em either im just goin off previous knowledge but my friend's are good with em "gsx eclipse '450hp', evo '400 hp'" i wasnt goin to do it myself either i was goin to buy it an have a shop do it. the dyno sheet showed like 130 hp over stock tho' but like i said im not up on turbo's.
Joined
·
1,283 Posts
Yeah first off, the motor really won't take it. Sure some people do it and show how quick their cars are on Youtube. What they don't show you is how often they have to tinker with them cause they didn't do it right, and how short lived the motor is.
To do this right, you either have to limit yourself to 7 lbs of boost, or you have to upgrade the engines internals and lower the compression and get the fuel management set up properly. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for it, its just not as simple as throwing a turbo on with some custom piping. It requires you to really do your homework. If you really want to pursue this, even if you aren't going to be doing the install, I recommend you get a book on the subject.
To do this right, you either have to limit yourself to 7 lbs of boost, or you have to upgrade the engines internals and lower the compression and get the fuel management set up properly. Don't get me wrong, I'm all for it, its just not as simple as throwing a turbo on with some custom piping. It requires you to really do your homework. If you really want to pursue this, even if you aren't going to be doing the install, I recommend you get a book on the subject.
Joined
·
671 Posts
Bit of math. All a turbo does is force more air into your engine. The boost = pressure increase over ambient air, meaning that normal air pressure is ~14.7 psi at sea level. So, 5 psi boost = ~19.7 psi to your intake manifold. So the whole hp thing: your engine makes power based on the amount of fuel/air it consumes. You have a 'tec, so 200 hp at 14.7 psi. at 5 psi boost, you're running 19.7/14.7, or 125% of your normal power, making an extra 50hp. 130 over stock would be 330/200 * 14.7, or 24.2 total pressure, or 9.5 psi. That's enough to vent a head gasket without proper tuning and monitoring, especially on an old engine.
This is all theoretical, too. I'm off today, so I'm not doing more complicated math, but a worn cam profile due to age, higher intake temperatures due to compression, and the poor piping required to shoehorn the turbo setup in our cars, and you won't be making the numbers on paper. (But it'll still be a blast over stock). Look at dropping at least $5,000 though.
Joined
·
2,492 Posts
The STS turbo isn't a "New" solution either. STS turbos are intended for simplification of instalation. No need for a custom header... however it still requires running intake piping...
A typical turbo system requires a header with a mounting place for the turbo.
STS turbos don't have "less lag" they are just smaller turbos for lower boost pressures.
If you know what you're doing you can do the same thing with a conventionally mounted turbo, and make more power than an STS system.
Anyway, everyone else stated exactly what I said. To put it simply, NO. It is NOT a DIY thing on a Taurus. There are no kits for it and boost tuning solutions are not readily available. A Taurus Duratec is not an MZR, or a 2JZ.
A typical turbo system requires a header with a mounting place for the turbo.
STS turbos don't have "less lag" they are just smaller turbos for lower boost pressures.
If you know what you're doing you can do the same thing with a conventionally mounted turbo, and make more power than an STS system.
Anyway, everyone else stated exactly what I said. To put it simply, NO. It is NOT a DIY thing on a Taurus. There are no kits for it and boost tuning solutions are not readily available. A Taurus Duratec is not an MZR, or a 2JZ.
i um never said it was a mzr i dont even knwo what that is i was just kinda wondering since i saw a vid on youtube with a taurus that had one on an was thinkin bout doin it myself. i get my car put in my name in january an was thinkin about buyin a beater car an modding my car more. if i cant do it i was goin to get bigger upper an lower intakes.
Joined
·
2,492 Posts
I didn't say you said that. I was using it as a comparison. The MZR is a Duratec family motor capable of handling decent amounts of boost unlike the Duratec 30 which isn't that durable under boost. :lol2:
To elaborate on your post, the intake plenum is already ridiculously large on these engines.. your problem you'd be running into is the valve size.. I'm pretty sure the tec's intake plenum is large enough to overflow the intake valve size. :lol2: So in true reality you'd be wasting your money. Your best bet is to spend your money on preventative maintenance and then pop a nice muffler on it and a good audio system and some nice wheels. B)
The tec' is already pumping out 200 horses... theres little you can do without spending the big bucks.. and none of those things are really DIY friendly...
My guess is this is your first car??
Joined
·
671 Posts
Foxbody mustangs came with a 302 at most, and you want to keep it at that. Chevy 350's are the number makers for small-blocks, but from all I've heard, the Ford 302 is the powerhouse of the two. The 351 makes a ton of torque, but there's not enough room to make a decent intake manifold to support the higher flow requirements, and it doesn't like to rev. Good for towing, not for racing. Just my two cents.
STS rear mount turbos do have some lag. I have some friends with the setup. Couple of them are drag racers and the lag is not an issue. They get the turbos up to speed waiting for the green light. The other application turbo lag is not an issue because the engine is compound forced induction. The engine is has a Positive Displacement supercharger and when the boost starts dropping from the supercharger the turbos take over. Best of both worlds but very complex.
Bob
Bob
lol i know what a 350 is my uncle has 4 of them for his ump modifieds an a 351 winsor if modding is the better motor they bolt in just about the same just the 351 is taller an would either need a open hood for the holly's to pop out of or a cowl hood.
reply
Funny , the 351w is a small block ford motor. This motor revs just as good if not better then a 302. All my experience is from sbf motors and I have built several in race trim that vary from a standard bore 351 with 450hp n/a to twin turbo 302 based motor with 840hp all were efi and had excellent street manners. The idea of a turbo on any motor is a very good one! You have to take in consideration of the compression ratio, current condition of the engine and the budget amount for tuning! You can put together a CHEAP but very good kit from ebay parts if your budget is small. It would also be good to have a friend who hase a welder and can use it properly!! When planning a turbo build up please pay attention to the fuel system and tunning parts! My 95 sho will see a custom built turbo system from me this year coming. Im learning the motor slowly but it seems to be a very good canidate for a 8-10lb set-up with the right fuel system and tuning. Just my 2cents Hope this helps
If you want to keep a stock block and push 500+ hp you need to either get a 351 or go for a 302 after market block. The stock 302 won't take much over that without basically splitting in half. Saying a Chevy 350 is a power maker is somewhat inaccurate, they could be considered cheaper to build on a $/hp ratio, but Fords after market is huge too and there's really no limit with either. Not to mention big blocks (fords are bigger
). The old SBC isn't really a power maker compared to an LS engine from what I know anyway, but then you start competing with mod engines and they have a lot going for them too.
Joined
·
671 Posts
I meant the chevy 350 makes more power due to displacement than a chevy 305, but the 351W needs a lot of encouragement to breathe anywhere near a 302W. I believe that a motor lighting up it's tires just to sign off at 5k rpm is useless compared to a motor that'll grip coming out of a corner & pull strong through 8k rpm. I don't want to be pissing in anyone's coffee, I'm just giving the OP other options to think about for a project he's not on yet. So let's everyone take a moment to un-twist our panties, and /threadjack.If you want to keep a stock block and push 500+ hp you need to either get a 351 or go for a 302 after market block. The stock 302 won't take much over that without basically splitting in half. Saying a Chevy 350 is a power maker is somewhat inaccurate, they could be considered cheaper to build on a $/hp ratio, but Fords after market is huge too and there's really no limit with either. Not to mention big blocks (fords are bigger
The 351 breather capabilities are very well, since 302 heads fit a 351 aswell , the 351 motors in the 60s and 70s had bigger valves hince breathing better, also a 4 barrel intake and carb where used and can be used on either, the 351 does use a wider intake. Im not sure why you say a 351 needs more to breath???? a 302 with a vic jr intake , victor jr heads and a comp cam with breath great at 6500rpm and be maxed out in rpm unless the cam is designed to pull to 7+ which isnt likly in any street form. A 351 will use the exact same heads, cam , and intake but make more hp do to its cubic inches right out of the gate, so why would it need something special to get it breathing?? Im not pissed or upset , Im just wondering how you come up with that conclusion thats all, sorry to the OP Im just wondering whats behind this theory. As for the 8k rpm chevy 305 or 350 wow good luck with that one, better have some nascar backing for it to hold up lol . Time for a coffee break,,, eeew I hate coffee , lol ... Just joking around here guys , no harm meant to anyone or to anger anybody, have a Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Join the discussion
