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Discussion Starter #1
So the rear head gasket finally went, and now the car is sitting in my driveway awaiting final judgement.

This isnt a question about how to replace the head gasket, but why.

Honestly, I hated the taurus. it wasnt what i wanted in a car. but over the years its grown on me. to the point that i dont want to get rid of it. but its time to be reasonable and consider my options.

The car has approx 135k miles on it. 5k ago (or so) the radiator blew up. i replaced it, but in the process screwed up the transmission. now the head gasket blew. thats going to cost a couple hundred, and made me think: how many more miles can i expect out of this car? its lived a long life, but if its not going to last, then i cant deal with it. the value of the car is not great. the new transmission cost more than the car is worth. so already there is more money in it than its worth, so its hard to say what to do. i dont want to just give up and say its not worth it, after already investing that much time and money, but i also dont want to keep spending money on something that is only going to last another 5k miles before something else blows up.

so basically im asking how many miles do taurus'es last for on average? now that im either going to fully pull the top end apart or just throw it away, what else should i consider? i mean its possible the head gasket isnt the only problem, and i dont want to pull the engine apart, only to find out it made piston soup after having spent money on the parts for it, things like that.
 

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Tauruses can last a very long time... to a little bit of time - it depends on how well the owners have taken care of it.

My Intrepid only lasted 4 months from when we bought it. The engine started knocking after 106K miles, and we didn't even want to mess with it. There were all sorts of little things wrong with it that the Taurus didn't have wrong. Granted, I miss the power, but in the long run, I know the Taurus was much better taken care of and she'll last me a very long time if I keep up with her.

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pick up a wrench and fix the headgaskets.. Its not that big of a deal.

You can have it back on the road for less than $150 if you do it yourself.. Less if you don't need to mill the heads.

I just did this on my '95, spent 1-1/2 days doing it with some buds over a few beers. We had a blast.


Here's pics of my project. It took me longer because I ported everything while it was apart..

http://www.taurusclub.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=9565

Jeramie
 

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Discussion Starter #4
I already have most of it apart, i quit after removing the intake manifold because it was getting dark. in the morning im going to pull the heads and change the gaskets.

on a side note, ive had an exhaust leak from the rear manifold gasket for a few months now, i even bought the new gaskets when the radiator went, but i never got around to installing it because i didnt want to take it all apart. now is the perfect time, lol.

i had been getting the impression (from this forum) that if you dont get the heads milled you are asking for trouble, but if its not warped it should be good, right?


oh, and the engine had been rebuilt previously, a few things i would like cleared up: the lower intake manifold took 3 different size wrenches to get the bolts out, shouldnt they all be the same size? (most were 14mm, one was 15mm, and two were 13mm) and also, the haynes manual says you need some special sockets for removing the head bolts, but in my car they are just regular bolts.

and i think this would be the perfect time to port/polish everything, since its all comming apart anyways.
 

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I heard that it's recommended to get FelPro or copper head gaskets as replacements so they don't blow so easliy again. I've heard different stories as to why they blow, but never one consistant story. It ranges from bad water jacket design to bad gasket material to not having the heads torqued down enough. I dunno. I'm just glad mine hasn't blown yet (or it has and has been fixed properly; my car's used so I have no history). *knocks on wood*
 

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Discussion Starter #6
IM a little confused, the kragen website has 3 different head gaskets listed

Fel Pro 9560SP
Fel Pro 9560SP
Fel Pro 9560PT

I have no idea why there are 2 identical part numbers for them.

also, is there a gasket set i can buy that will have all the needed gaskets?
 

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Mr. Tom,

I dont know about you..but, I would never buy a Taurus again.

At 60,000 Miles the Transmission Blew up..due to a Ford Manufacture Defect...they had an aluminum piston, when a Steel piston should have been installed at the factory and Motor Mounts went..Total Cost $3,000.00

At 83,000 Miles the Front Head Gaskets Blew up and destroyed my Engine, even thou the car was bought into the shop the very next day. Total Cost $4,400.00

All these defects, were not due to lack of maintanence or anything I could have prevented. If, you check the Internet, you will see see that the Taurus has a bad history.

Keep in mind, if, you express anything negative against Ford, the Moderator will block you and lock you out. I suspect this is a FORD SPONSORED SITE!!!!!

I personally, would get rid of your Car and do what I plan on doing...GOING WITH A FOREIGN CAR. At least you have a chance of getting your Monies Worth..I did not dream at 83,000 miles..that is as far as I would get with this car.

P.S. FORD WILL NOT ANSWER NOR ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEFECTS...YET THERE ARE TONS OF COMPLAINTS AT THE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORATION IN WASHINGTON, AND TONS OF HORRIBLE STORIES ON INTERNET...AND MANY, MANY CLASS ACTION SUITS.
 

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Your back again? :blink: :unsure: I am confused why you come back here if you hate Ford so much. WHY?!?!
 

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Originally posted by DEARBORN@Oct 24 2004, 08:59 AM
Mr. Tom,

I dont know about you..but, I would never buy a Taurus again.

At 60,000 Miles the Transmission Blew up..due to a Ford Manufacture Defect...they had an aluminum piston, when a Steel piston should have been installed at the factory and Motor Mounts went..Total Cost $3,000.00

At 83,000 Miles the Front Head Gaskets Blew up and destroyed my Engine, even thou the car was bought into the shop the very next day. Total Cost $4,400.00

All these defects, were not due to lack of maintanence or anything I could have prevented. If, you check the Internet, you will see see that the Taurus has a bad history.

Keep in mind, if, you express anything negative against Ford, the Moderator will block you and lock you out. I suspect this is a FORD SPONSORED SITE!!!!!

I personally, would get rid of your Car and do what I plan on doing...GOING WITH A FOREIGN CAR. At least you have a chance of getting your Monies Worth..I did not dream at 83,000 miles..that is as far as I would get with this car.

P.S. FORD WILL NOT ANSWER NOR ACKNOWLEDGE ANY DEFECTS...YET THERE ARE TONS OF COMPLAINTS AT THE DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORATION IN WASHINGTON, AND TONS OF HORRIBLE STORIES ON INTERNET...AND MANY, MANY CLASS ACTION SUITS.
You really need to go away. We all know about your bad experience with your car, we've known about these problems for quite some time. We are trying to help Mr. Tom fix his car so that these problems don't happen again, and of course the troll must show his face once more. I hope your removed from these forums, so we don't have to read your worthless posts anymore. :rolleyes:
 

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You can get a "head set" which has all of the needed upper engine gaskets.. It also has new valve seals if you wanted to replace those.

Definitly the way to go for doing headgaskets..

I would not use anything other than the felpro blue gaksets. There is a stronger gasket, but it requires you to pull the engine and re-surface the block deck as well as the head surface. Its the Multi Layered Steel (MLS) gasket from the 4.2L f-150 truck engine. But it won't work unless you have a mirror finish on both surfaces. Its really only necessary on big boost applications.

Don't forget to get new headbolts too, you can't re-use the old ones.

I'm making over 400 crank horespower on the felpro blue gaskets under 15psi of boost on my 3.8L Thunderbird SC (same headgasket as taurus acutally). I've been driving it hard for over 3 years now and haven't had any problems.

Just make sure the surfaces are extremely clean before you put the new gasket on. Also make sure to torque the heads down properly.

If the heads aren't smooth or have knicks in them, I would get them surfaced.. Shouldn't cost more than $50 for the pair. As a bonus, sufaced heads will raise your compression ratio, and get you another 5-7 hp or so.

Jeramie
 

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Malta Taurus,

Of course anyone that expresses the truth is put down. This is human nature.
Its people like you Malta Taurus that can only call people names, Troll, Newbie, etc. etc...simple people.

I gave my thoughts and opinion about what Mr. Tom should do...get rid of his car as fast as he can. I think he spent enough on it already..and its not going to get better. The car has MAJOR MANUFACTURE DEFECTS.

Of course, Im getting attacked again!!!! because, the truth hurts!!! I guess you cant express any thoughts here. Attack is the only way you know how to respond to the FACTS!!!!

Its not your pocket that was out the money, so, of course you not the least concerned. See, if, you would like that expense. It seems strange, that anyone else that I tell at work, understands, because, they have had Ford cars and got rid of them for similar problems. Only this site, seems to attack..I dont care if it is Ford, or Toyota..a car that has this many problems at only 83,000 miles is a MANUFACTURE PROBLEM, WHICH FORD WILL NOT LIVE UP TO!!!

I have had many other cars, that never had Head Gaskets, Motor Mounts, or Transmission pistons give out, like this piece of CRAP I HAVE ..sitting in my driveway dead. Im not about to spend anymore money, when it clearly is only going to happen again.

If, Im here again, its to alert people that they are not alone.

The real issue is not me..ITS FORD AND THE POOR QUALITY THAT COMES OUT OF THERE PLANTS.

I called up the Department of Transporation to complain about all these defects..and they have files knee deep on this Taurus. The girl on the phone said her Father worked at Ford for over 25 years and would never let her buy a FORD..for fear she would break down on a lonely road...That should tell you something!!!!
 

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Originally posted by DEARBORN@Oct 24 2004, 12:03 PM
Malta Taurus,

Of course anyone that expresses the truth is put down. This is human nature.
Its people like you Malta Taurus that can only call people names, Troll, Newbie, etc. etc...simple people.

I gave my thoughts and opinion about what Mr. Tom should do...get rid of his car as fast as he can. I think he spent enough on it already..and its not going to get better. The car has MAJOR MANUFACTURE DEFECTS.

Of course, Im getting attacked again!!!! because, the truth hurts!!! I guess you cant express any thoughts here. Attack is the only way you know how to respond to the FACTS!!!!

Its not your pocket that was out the money, so, of course you not the least concerned. See, if, you would like that expense. It seems strange, that anyone else that I tell at work, understands, because, they have had Ford cars and got rid of them for similar problems. Only this site, seems to attack..I dont care if it is Ford, or Toyota..a car that has this many problems at only 83,000 miles is a MANUFACTURE PROBLEM, WHICH FORD WILL NOT LIVE UP TO!!!

I have had many other cars, that never had Head Gaskets, Motor Mounts, or Transmission pistons give out, like this piece of CRAP I HAVE ..sitting in my driveway dead. Im not about to spend anymore money, when it clearly is only going to happen again.

If, Im here again, its to alert people that they are not alone.

The real issue is not me..ITS FORD AND THE POOR QUALITY THAT COMES OUT OF THERE PLANTS.

I called up the Department of Transporation to complain about all these defects..and they have files knee deep on this Taurus. The girl on the phone said her Father worked at Ford for over 25 years and would never let her buy a FORD..for fear she would break down on a lonely road...That should tell you something!!!!
ok "Mr DEARBORN"
if you are having such a horrible time with your car..then why not get rid of it?
Throw up a price and I'll see if its reasonable.
Nobody here wan't to bash you just beacuse you say the car is junk. Its because of your approach.
You say the secret is to buy foreign? Lets not go down that road, I've owned my share of cars foreign and domestic and all have their share of issues.
Instead of trying to bash the cars and the people here I say either try to get all the people here to try to help you out, or simply find another venue to voice your opinion.
Again..I say, if you think your car is that crappy..come up with a price and I'll see what I can do to take that "lawn ornament" off your hands.
 

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I got $100 CASH right now for your broken car. Just have your title handy so we can get the paper work taken care of. I will pick it up in Dearborn and tow it to my place. The only condition is that you never post about this again.
 
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Originally posted by DEARBORN@Oct 24 2004, 11:03 AM
Of course, Im getting attacked again!!!! because, the truth hurts!!! I guess you cant express any thoughts here. Attack is the only way you know how to respond to the FACTS!!!!
You get attacked because of the way you post. In all of your posts, you've made sure to mention how we're a Ford sponsored site, or at least Ford lovers and you'll get attacked no matter how you present the information. That's pretty much setting yourself up, in my opinion.

EVERYONE here has a right to voice their opinion, as long as it's presented in a manner that isn't a personal attack, and somewhat reasonable.

I can understand that you've had problems with your car, however we're here to help each other. Going overboard and posting the way you do does not help anyone, it causes controversy and arguments, and gets us way off topic.

Point blank, if you go to any site that's about a particular model of car and bash it, you can expect some grief, especially if you do it in the way that you do. You can either be a helpful part of a community, or you can be removed from the community.

Now on to the problem at hand:

Obviously, a vehicle is the worst investment one could ever make. You'll almost always spend more than the car is worth on a major repair, or even in mods alone. Only you can decide if it's worth it to you to repair it, or cut your losses and move on. Honestly though, if it were my car, I'd repair it. I look at it this way, you'll be able to repair it for much cheaper than you could buy another car that will be reliable. Sure, you could buy another used car, but who knows what the condition of that one will be?

As far as the heads go, I'd definitely have them checked at an automotive machine shop unless you have the means to do it yourself. Heck, I have the means and I still bring them to my automotive machinist to get checked. He pressure checks them, which will show cracks, or bad valve seats, cleans them up, and resurfaces them for around $130. Cheap insurance, in my opinion.

Good luck with the car, whatever you decide to do, and of course let us know if you need any help!
 

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He did state that he started working on his car.. So he obviously wants to keep it for the time being..

These boards, especially the "maintenance and repair" forum are for helping people out. This is not a place to come to tell every person that has a problem with their car to get rid of it. That is not being helpful at this point..

I give Mr. Tom a big thumbs up for putting effort into his car, and attempting to learn how to fix it. Rather than taking the easy way out and just whining and complaining about it.

If you need any help with the job, just ask.. I've done headgaskets a couple times on a 3.8L taurus..

I'd go ahead and mill the heads down a bit.. Even if they've already been milled once, another .005" shouldn't hurt.

Also, dressing the felpro gakets with some copper spray will give you some extra insurance.. The felpro guide says you don't have to, but its good insurance.

hope this helps!
 

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Also, all the intake bolts should be 15mm.. That's odd they are different sizes
 
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Originally posted by DEARBORN@Oct 24 2004, 08:59 AM
I suspect this is a FORD SPONSORED SITE!!!!!
I missed this part. I could only WISH that this site was sponsored by Ford, or we could at least get them to endorse us somehow. Fact of the matter is, this site, and this club, is wholly supported by member donations. Legally, it's owned by me, however this club belongs to all of its members. I keep my nose out of things until it's needed.

The fact that you have suspicions about the intent of this site aggravates me to no end. We've all helped many members, and will continue to do so as long as there's a need.
 

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Originally posted by Mr. Tom@Oct 23 2004, 10:43 PM
the lower intake manifold took 3 different size wrenches to get the bolts out, shouldnt they all be the same size? (most were 14mm, one was 15mm, and two were 13mm) and also, the haynes manual says you need some special sockets for removing the head bolts, but in my car they are just regular bolts.
I just took my lowerr intake out earlier this weak and i believe it was held in by several torx bolts.
 

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I just took my lowerr intake out earlier this weak and i believe it was held in by several torx bolts.
Yes, that may be correct for a 3.0L vulcan.. He was referring to his 3.8L Essex engine.
 

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Yeah, tranny should have had a steel piston, oh well, and head gaskets oh know. I bought a piston for my car for 20 bucks...and head gaskets....Ive seen head gaskets go in any automobile....My friends '91 civic with 50k miles needed a new head gasket, as well as a guy i worked with....so did my cousins grand prix quad 4, and several dodge engines...its a part of an engine that can fail...And just because some people have head gasket issues on there 3.8, doesnt mean that the other engines of the family, including the duratec, vulcan, and yamaha motors were bad, And I've seen many ford transmissions last a long time...We put 100k the the familys '93 vulcan easy, 80mph on the highway daily, plus ALOT of around town drivin...and never a transmission fluid change or filter...I even put it in a ditch during the winter to avoid an accident going 45-50 into a mound of solid iced over dirt with no damage...The car was traded in, and ran perfect...we simply needed a van. As for my '96 Taurus, 143k, with some front end work do to my driving habits and an accident...I'm very pleased with its reliability and power...Your not going to find a better made vehical for the price.

As for you Tom... if you've put a resonable amount of money into the car, and the body, undercarraige, interior, ect is in good shape I would just fix the head gasket and see how much life you can get out of it. Any used car your going to buy is going to need work somewhere, I Dont know what your budget is but I'd personally rather fix an exaust leak...$150 gasket than go spend 3 or 4 thousand on another vehical thats probably going to need exaust work, tune up, brake job, ect....and on top of that your buying a vehical you dont know at all....you dont know who had it, how it was treated, ect ect...at least with your car you know whats been done to a great extent, one of the reasons I put a little here and there on my car (axels, bearings, power steering rack) even tho it has 143k...It looks good, runs good, and I know whats gonna break... Also personally...I dont find myself buying a new car...having the car payment...having full coverage insurance...and paying that much for transpertation...for what i would pay (as a teenager) for full coverage insurance...I might as well have a brand new drivetrain installed in my car every year.... I stick with my $90 car payment and $180 a month for my liability and comp. insurance instead. I Dont know if my spiel will help you at all....but I'm sure it will help you more than the nonsense from another individual. And if this site is somehow directly associated to ford, good...obviously they car more about there consumers than other companys if they have a car club...right?
 
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