[02Taurus-SE]

Hello guys, i sure by now most of you should know me, the kid that locked up his engine...

For those wondering what happen. It was not my Syncro Shaft... i dont even have one.

I have a 2002 Ford Taurus SE 3.0L V6 OHV (Gasoline... not Vulcan).. My uncle (also my mechanic) told me my oil pump stop working.. Bad luck i guess.

Anyways, my engine is locked, and we cant reach the torque converter bolts. So i cant lift my engine from the top.

We gonna drop the sub frame, and then drop the engine and tranny from the bottom..

Like i said i have a 2002 Ford Taurus Engine 3.0L V6 OHV (Gasoline) and i need to find out the furtherest year possible from the junk yard.

i found a 2002 engine, has 69,000 miles good condition for $650, but wanna see if i can find a better one....

Please someone help me

 

[durasel]

Can't help much but you do have the vulcan engine, it came in gasoline and FFV versions.

 

[Jeff K]

If you dont have a syncro shaft / CMP, then you dont have an OHV engine, you have a Duratec DOHC 24 valve engine. If you have a 12 valve OHV cam in block engine, you have a Vulcan, which does have the failure prone syncro /CMP. Before you try ripping it out / finding a replacement, I suggest you figure out for sure what engine you have!

If you have a 24V DOHC engine, you are the first one I ever heard of with an oil pump failure. Oil pump is directly driven off the front of the crankshaft in the DOHC, and is very robust. Any chance you ran it out of oil?

 

[JW657]

Hello guys, i sure by now most of you should know me, the kid that locked up his engine...

For those wondering what happen. It was not my Syncro Shaft... i dont even have one.

I have a 2002 Ford Taurus SE 3.0L V6 OHV (Gasoline... not Vulcan).. My uncle (also my mechanic) told me my oil pump stop working.. Bad luck i guess.

Anyways, my engine is locked, and we cant reach the torque converter bolts. So i cant lift my engine from the top.

We gonna drop the sub frame, and then drop the engine and tranny from the bottom..

Like i said i have a 2002 Ford Taurus Engine 3.0L V6 OHV (Gasoline) and i need to find out the furtherest year possible from the junk yard.

i found a 2002 engine, has 69,000 miles good condition for $650, but wanna see if i can find a better one....

Please someone help me

Hello Again.

As stated above, you have an OHV Ford Vulcan engine. It displaces 3.0 litres and has been made available in flex fuel or gas versions, Vulcan is the name of the engine. What did the syncro look like? Are you basing this info on what was found after an inspection and tear down? The camshaft syncro drives the pump, once it goes your pump stops. Still sounds like your situation. Anything is possible though, I don't believe these oil pumps are overly known for failing otherwise.

$650 for a used engine seems steep to me.

 

[02Taurus-SE]

Okay.. Well my uncle said i had a oil pump fail.... I have not seen my car since i towed it the day it locked...

From the dealer book yes i do have a Vulcan 3.0L OHV V6 (Gasoline). No body knows the futherest year i can go ?

As for why, and what happen to my car we dont know. My uncle dont have time now to pull everything about and tell me what happen. Just that my oil pump failed me.

I did ask him once if i had a syncro shaft, but he told me no because my car is a OHV not a DOHV. But i guess he could have been mistaken.

From what i saw, this is what we did when the car came into the shop.

First my uncle try to turn on the car. All you hear Bump, or Clump noise, no movement what so ever. My uncle checks the oil, then we check if the starter wires, and connection are good. battery has power. So we remove the starter, and remove the serpentine belt and try to move the engine block like that.. and thats when we found out i locked my engine.

now i just need a new engine just want to know the furthest year possible.

 

[austex04]

If the engine from '04+ would work if you can transfer the intake over, there's one down here from a '06 that only has 43k miles, A grade part, asking $285. The '02 year engines seem to be more expensive, on car-part.com, probably becouse Ford didn't make that style of intake for very long. The syncro sensor is buried under a wire loom on the drivers side of the vulcan engine, where the distributor once was.

 

[rudedog]

you can use any vulcan up to '07.

 

[JW657]

Okay.. Well my uncle said i had a oil pump fail.... I have not seen my car since i towed it the day it locked...

From the dealer book yes i do have a Vulcan 3.0L OHV V6 (Gasoline). No body knows the futherest year i can go ?

As for why, and what happen to my car we dont know. My uncle dont have time now to pull everything about and tell me what happen. Just that my oil pump failed me.

I did ask him once if i had a syncro shaft, but he told me no because my car is a OHV not a DOHV. But i guess he could have been mistaken.

From what i saw, this is what we did when the car came into the shop.

First my uncle try to turn on the car. All you hear Bump, or Clump noise, no movement what so ever. My uncle checks the oil, then we check if the starter wires, and connection are good. battery has power. So we remove the starter, and remove the serpentine belt and try to move the engine block like that.. and thats when we found out i locked my engine.

now i just need a new engine just want to know the furthest year possible.

He must not be very versed in how an engine works to make that statement. I'm sure it seized and all, however you're just assuming the car randomly let you down when it was probably the fact that you let the syncro shaft go too long before changing it. The Camshaft Synchronizer is basically the lower half of a distributor. It wouldn't take more than a few minutes to pull the thing to see if it sheared or something, but that's only if you really want to prove us wrong.

It means pretty much nothing to this conversation, so I'm ready to drop it, it just irks me that you came back and announced that everyone here must be wrong about the diagnosis because the part doesn't exist (it does though) and that you have an engine that doesn't run on Vulcanoline, but instead gasoline.

Here's all the quotes from people who answered this question in your previous threads:

As far as what year range, you can probably go from 2000 up to 2007 Taurus/Sable because it is OBD-II and the same generation. (I would still make sure all of the accessories match up between the two engines. If they don't just take the ones off of yours and put them on the new one.)

There's tons of '06-'07 engines out there, as many rental cars have been totaled out. Those will probably have very low miles, I've seen some on car-parts.com that had less than 20k on the miles, sometimes going for as little as $500 each. The barter system is great! Maybe your uncle has house/yard work, or other work around that you can do for him in exchange.

Short blocks are all very similar, I think you could. Here's a very good article talking about the engine: Rebuilding The Ford 3.0L Engine

How did she end up going out? Did the camshaft syncro shear? Or did the engine just randomly lock?

I'm sorry to hear that you engine failed, I wish you would have listened to me and stopped driving it. I suggest going to car-parts.com to look for a engine. Most salvage yards will list the mileage on the cars they pulled the engines from. If you can transfer the intake over, try to find a '04-up engine, it has lighter valves and a few other mechanical updates.

 

[Dubeckyj]

Anyways, my engine is locked, and we cant reach the torque converter bolts. So i cant lift my engine from the top.

We gonna drop the sub frame, and then drop the engine and tranny from the bottom..

I don't know how your mechanic uncle plans to do this, but the best way to access those TC bolts are to un-stuck your engine. This involves dropping the oil pan, and loosening off main caps and rod caps until the crank spins. This is easier to do while the engine's still in the car, and the car is 6 ft in the air on a lift.

 

[02Taurus-SE]

Alright guys im back, and well if i was dumb enough to lock my engine, then i am doumb enough to not understand my uncle or you guys...

My uncle did check the snycro, but he does not call it that. I called him about a day ago and asked about my car and stuff, and well he repeated himself kinda pissed off, and told me my camshaft was fine. So i guess my uncle calls it somthing different, or i just was not hearing him good.

As far as the car, we not 100% sure, but hes really positive that its the oil pump failed me. Like i said my uncle dont have much time since hes working alone, and this shop was bought by my grandpa and passed down to him, 45 years, and still going this lil mom-pop shop.... So i have faith my uncle knows what his doing.

As far as droping the engine, this is not what he said, but i think we cant just unlock the engine because it snap and brake... My guess, and since the engine still connected with the transmission, i guess braking the engine would not be a good thing now...

But ill be sure to take pictures of how we droped the engine, of my future engine and what not. this friday i get paid and i pray is enough to start on my car...

Sorry if i got any of you guys upset, this is why i signed up on this forum id like to learn about my car..

 

[02Taurus-SE]

If the engine from '04+ would work if you can transfer the intake over, there's one down here from a '06 that only has 43k miles, A grade part, asking $285. The '02 year engines seem to be more expensive, on car-part.com, probably becouse Ford didn't make that style of intake for very long. The syncro sensor is buried under a wire loom on the drivers side of the vulcan engine, where the distributor once was.

yea, my uncle said he can do it, and that we just use my intake and transfer it..

 

[01SE]

No offense, but from your posts I would suggest that you find another mechanic, the one that mostly specializes in engine work. As not all mechanics are the same, some do just the maintenance work, some transmission work and others work on the engine.

 

[Dubeckyj]

Alright guys im back, and well if i was dumb enough to lock my engine, then i am doumb enough to not understand my uncle or you guys...

My uncle did check the snycro, but he does not call it that. I called him about a day ago and asked about my car and stuff, and well he repeated himself kinda pissed off, and told me my camshaft was fine. So i guess my uncle calls it somthing different, or i just was not hearing him good.

As far as the car, we not 100% sure, but hes really positive that its the oil pump failed me. Like i said my uncle dont have much time since hes working alone, and this shop was bought by my grandpa and passed down to him, 45 years, and still going this lil mom-pop shop.... So i have faith my uncle knows what his doing.

As far as droping the engine, this is not what he said, but i think we cant just unlock the engine because it snap and brake... My guess, and since the engine still connected with the transmission, i guess braking the engine would not be a good thing now...

But ill be sure to take pictures of how we droped the engine, of my future engine and what not. this friday i get paid and i pray is enough to start on my car...

Sorry if i got any of you guys upset, this is why i signed up on this forum id like to learn about my car..

No, really. The exact thing happened to me, and I know exactly what happened, and how to replace the engine. Your synchro assembly seized. I recall reading somewhere it has oiling issues. Upon seizing, the gear on your camshaft sheared off the gear on your synchro, and either the shavings dropped into your oil pump, killing that; or the cam no longer drove the CPS, thus not driving the oil pump. Your oil pump DID stop, but it's because your cam synchro assembly quit.

Also, re-read my other post. This is the easiest method I found. If anything breaks, it's due to incompetence.

 

[JW657]

Alright guys im back, and well if i was dumb enough to lock my engine, then i am doumb enough to not understand my uncle or you guys...

My uncle did check the snycro, but he does not call it that. I called him about a day ago and asked about my car and stuff, and well he repeated himself kinda pissed off, and told me my camshaft was fine. So i guess my uncle calls it somthing different, or i just was not hearing him good.

As far as the car, we not 100% sure, but hes really positive that its the oil pump failed me. Like i said my uncle dont have much time since hes working alone, and this shop was bought by my grandpa and passed down to him, 45 years, and still going this lil mom-pop shop.... So i have faith my uncle knows what his doing.

As far as droping the engine, this is not what he said, but i think we cant just unlock the engine because it snap and brake... My guess, and since the engine still connected with the transmission, i guess braking the engine would not be a good thing now...

But ill be sure to take pictures of how we droped the engine, of my future engine and what not. this friday i get paid and i pray is enough to start on my car...

Sorry if i got any of you guys upset, this is why i signed up on this forum id like to learn about my car..

Well, firstly I want to mention that it's really your fault either way. The symptoms were there, something was seriously wrong and everyone here knew the car needed attention asap, even if it was the oil pump, you still ignored it and ruined the engine. There's no point in discussing this point further, I really don't care about it. Everyone makes mistakes and I have made ones bigger than what you did so don't get me wrong, I'm not saying that I'm smarter than you. There's just no point in discussing it. "crying over spilled milk"

As stated above, the symptoms are classic failure of the Syncro. Like I said earlier, tell him that it's the bottom half of a distributor, like the gear part. He'll probably get that. It's a sensor because there used to be a distributor there before they went to the coil pack or whatever. It has always failed since they went to that setup. It drives the oil pump. It's not a sensor, it's an entire casting with a gear that has a sensor on top.



I know what your uncle is thinking, he's just ignoring what you've said and he doesn't believe people on the internet are as smart as he is. I can't change that, this is how most mechanics think anyway. He's probably a little insulted that you think you know something about cars, or that you're suggesting that you might know why the car is broken. He sounds like a typical old mechanic. You could always call the Ford dealer in your area, or go there and see if you can talk to a veteran mechanic, tell him what happened to your car exactly, ask him what he thinks the cause of failure is (don't suggest what it is). I bet he'll tell you what was said here previously.

I'm not insulting you or your uncle with that statement, I just know how they tend to think. Mechanics don't want your help, they don't want you to diagnose the issue, they don't want you around them while they work, they don't want you asking questions in general, they don't care about what you think. That's what a mechanic is.

Don't let the forum get you down, by the way. Everyone here is pretty nice, just a little bitchy. We're still nicer than a lot of mechanics! B)

 

[ricer333]

Heed the advice of the last two posts!

If your uncle still presses forward with the OPPOSITE of what Dubeckyi and JW have said, then do it yourself. It's really not that bad of a job and there are plenty of posts in the Topic Finder (search for CPS or synchro).

I just did the job last weekend

Also, to add to above. Ford went to a 'distributor-less' system in 1996 (right guys/gals)? If you do a wikipedia lookup on Vulcan engine or Google search distributor-less systems you can gain a bit more knowledge.

 

[JW657]

Heed the advice of the last two posts!

If your uncle still presses forward with the OPPOSITE of what Dubeckyi and JW have said, then do it yourself. It's really not that bad of a job and there are plenty of posts in the Topic Finder (search for CPS or synchro).

I just did the job last weekend

Also, to add to above. Ford went to a 'distributor-less' system in 1996 (right guys/gals)? If you do a wikipedia lookup on Vulcan engine or Google search distributor-less systems you can gain a bit more knowledge.

Unfortunately, it would be too late for that as he already locked the engine and ruined it.

Everyone makes mistakes, consider it a learning experience. When you hear an old person say they're wiser than you, what they really mean is they've screwed up 50x more than you ever have and they've gained lots of knowledge from it. He likely won't let an engine oil light go unchecked again, he learned his lesson, and there's lots of lessons I've had to learn in a similar fashion, it's human nature I guess.

A really good mechanic can change that engine in about 5 or 6 hours. Also, don't let mileage fool you, my Vulcan had 160,000 on it and still worked great. It doesn't have to be a spring chicken, but if you can find one go for it.

 

[rudedog]

yes r333, in '96. And, yes for someone with NO experience, it could be a very big job, not just a few minutes. None the less, if you're actually smarter than you type, you should be able to handle it. I can do them in about an hour, or so. If I were you, I'd allot at least a day. And remember, it has to be lined up, although it does not control engine timing, it DOES affect fuel injector timing. There is a special tool for cam synchro alignment.

On another note, you and your g-pa should really listen to people on this forum, we've ALL seen time and time again, the specific failure of these parts, so we know that it's a fairly common occurance. After all, isn't that why you came here, because you figured "it's a Taurus forum .... they should know something, right?

good luck.

 

[austex04]

Don't forget to put a new syncro on the new engine before you put it in, for good measure!

 

[ricer333]

yes, and unfortunetly, if the gearing did shave off as Dube mentioned above, simply pulling it out and replacing it WITHOUT the alignment tool is probably not an option. You will have to get #1 Cylinder to TDC and then align the Synchro. Otherwise, who knows what position that synchro is in w/o the gear.