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Which transmission or transaxles do club members have in thier Taurus?

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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
I have a 1999 Taurus; tranny rebuilt around 63,000 mi in 2003. Now in 2010 I have about 153,000 mi on it. Back in March I found myself backing out of my driveway without reverse...aka just rolling down the slope. Also the P0760 code was found. Had it looked at by the same shop that fixed it back in 2003 but to know avail couldn't duplicate the problem. They recommended having the transmission service so I had that done and then sent me on my way.

Now here it is in Dec, approximately 600 mi more on it and it is doing it again. No reverse and the P0760 code showing up. They tell me the P0760 code is an electrical solenoid "c" issue that may or may not be related to not having reverse.

Does anyone have any ideas as to what could be going on with this AX4S?

Has anyone changed out the AX4S for the more reliable AX4N?

Can it be done?

Thanks for any and all input.
Tom
 

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No the transmissions can't be swapped without changing PCMs, they're too different. It would be best to get the transmission repaired, it's probably a retainer for that shift solenoid that is loose. The valve body can be accessed from the side pan area, it takes some labor, but if the transaxle's shift points are OK and nothing is slipping, it's better than paying for a rebuild. The AX4Ns aren't really more reliable, they both have a lot of failure points.
 

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If it is an intermittent problem and the solenoid code has nothing to do with the transmission, you could just have some junk caught in the valve body.

I had a problem where my AX4S was taking forever to get past first gear while driving until it warmed up. (Like 10 minutes) I bought some Lucas Transmission Oil Conditioner and added it in after draining some fluid so it wouldn't overflow.

Long story short: 20,000 miles later I have had no further problems.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Well Everybody,

The Bull has been in the cave for a week.....it has the tech stumped. He has dropped the bottom pan to pressurize the rear piston...it holds very well...he has removed the side cover pan to check the solenoid "C" that is given the P0760 code and it is OK. They have done other checks to find the problem but cannot. They even then tore down the valve body and didn't find anything. They wanted to remove the tranny but I told them no. Lets face it the car is not worth putting more money into it to get fixed. KBB says it is worth about $600.00. I probably have something like a grand in it with all their troubleshooting and still with no fix. Looks like i'll just have to drive it with out reverse. OH YA that will be fun

:zumbujump:

Does any body have a way to monitor that "C" solenoid? I would like to figure out a way to watch it when it gets energized with a lamp of some sort. I am just curious to see how it operates with reverse and the other FWD gears. I want to know if it is really acting up causing the problem. Now that I think about it, does anybody know what controls the functions of the solenoids? Is there a chart or table the shows what they do when so I have something to compare with what I see in the car?

Thanks for all help.
<<((THE BROKEN BULL))>>
tom
 

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Cake monster
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Well Everybody,

The Bull has been in the cave for a week.....it has the tech stumped. He has dropped the bottom pan to pressurize the rear piston...it holds very well...he has removed the side cover pan to check the solenoid "C" that is given the P0760 code and it is OK. They have done other checks to find the problem but cannot. They even then tore down the valve body and didn't find anything. They wanted to remove the tranny but I told them no. Lets face it the car is not worth putting more money into it to get fixed. KBB says it is worth about $600.00. I probably have something like a grand in it with all their troubleshooting and still with no fix. Looks like i'll just have to drive it with out reverse. OH YA that will be fun

:zumbujump:

Does any body have a way to monitor that "C" solenoid? I would like to figure out a way to watch it when it gets energized with a lamp of some sort. I am just curious to see how it operates with reverse and the other FWD gears. I want to know if it is really acting up causing the problem. Now that I think about it, does anybody know what controls the functions of the solenoids? Is there a chart or table the shows what they do when so I have something to compare with what I see in the car?

Thanks for all help.
<<((THE BROKEN BULL))>>
tom
The transmission is the most expensive weak point in these cars I guess. I'm surprised that they didn't find the issue.
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
I Like PIE but I will eat cake too

Yes I am somewhat disappointed that he didn't find anything too. They gave it their best shot. They have been in the trany business since 1959 so I am pretty confident in their ability to do things right. It is just one of them flukes P0760 code and no reverse when cold.

Keep an ear out when things warm up again and I got a little money saved up I am moving on up to the next generation bull. I am thinking a 2008 model.

Does any body have any other suggestion? I appreciate all input

Thanks again.
<<((THE BROKEN BULL))>>
tom
 

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Does any body have any other suggestion?<<((THE BROKEN BULL))>>
tom
Pay them to finish repairing it. I have no idea why you would give it to them, pay for some teardown and diagnostic, then take it back before it's fixed. If you're not going to spend the money to fix it, then that's that. No point in pursuing it further.
 

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Pay them to finish repairing it. I have no idea why you would give it to them, pay for some teardown and diagnostic, then take it back before it's fixed. If you're not going to spend the money to fix it, then that's that. No point in pursuing it further.
+1^
 

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Reverse is completely hydraulic (no solenoids) in these transmissions. The shift lever moves a valve to direct hydraulic pressure to the reverse clutch. The forward clutch is also engaged, but you would have other problems if that were not working.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
"Pay them to finish repairing it. I have no idea why you would give it to them, pay for some teardown and diagnostic, then take it back before it's fixed. If you're not going to spend the money to fix it, then that's that. No point in pursuing it further."

Well I understand what you saying and this is what I am thinking:

I was wondering about the solenoid "C" as to what it played in relation to reverse Open or closed as well as the other gear positions? Is the valve that it operates part of any hydraulic pressure flow for reverse. A reverse flow diagram would be nice to look over.

My thought with the lamp was to see if the "C" was operating out of sync causing the problem code P0760. What tells "C" to turn "off" and "ON"? Since the solenoid works OK?

The other thing is that I only loose reverse when the trany is cold, after 8 miles it will work OK. I don't think I need to have it torn down any farther, would you?

"Reverse is completely hydraulic (no solenoids) in these transmissions. The shift lever moves a valve to direct hydraulic pressure to the reverse clutch. The forward clutch is also engaged, but you would have other problems if that were not working."

If it is completely hydraulic then why am I also getting a P0760 fault code?

Thanks for all your thoughts and input,

<<((THE BROKEN BULL))>>
tom
 

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If you really want to know how these work, get a copy of the factory service manuals. They are excellent. I got my set on ebay for about $20 and they are in perfect condition. I'll try to post the reverse flow diagram.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Sheila, He also stated that the forward clutch was also engaged. By the flow chart "C" is off allowing fluid to the Forward Clutch control valve and the 3-4 shift valve. What I want to check with the lamp is to see if "C" is on while I am in reverse when cold. This would prohibit the fluid flow to the Forward Clutch Control Valve causing my problem.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 · (Edited)
Hey All,

An update on the <<((The Broken Bull))>>, after talking with the tech about the problem he decided to trouble shoot further in the direction of the wiring for the solenoid “C”. I could tell that he was not happy with himself in not being able to fix the issue. We have all been there, sleepless nights…waking up in the middle of an early morning with that nagging problem that just wouldn’t go away…coming up with an idea to trouble-shoot or fix the problem while you are in the shower getting ready for work…Yes any tech forth his salt will experience the above with out a doubt. It just goes to show us that we are caring individuals. As such the tech figured out a way to duplicate the problem…Guess what he did?

Alright I’ll tell you. All because it is something I thing every bull owner ought to be aware of especially if you are experiencing my problem: “NO REVERSE AND A FAULY CODE P0760”. Just to make a long story short, a ground activates these solenoids and there is power to them all the time. The Tech opened up the wiring harness to gain access to the wire that actives “C” every time he grounded the wire he got no reverse and the P0760 fault code. So some where in the harness is a bad spot that is chaffing on the wire. He said it was in the harness internal to the transmission were it was bad. So there you have it ladies and gentlemen, you get no reverse and the P0760 fault code. Problem solved. The Tech is a happy man and he will sleep 100% better tonight. And now I am a happy Bull owner.



Once again thanks for all your input and responses I look forward to posting more on your forum.

I think my next mod might be a trany cooler for the <<((THE BROKEN BULL))>> before any other major trany problems occur.

What other mods can be done to the AX4S/ AXODE trans axle?

Thanks again ALL.

<<((The Broken BULL))>> rides again,
Tom
 

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Hey All,

An update on the <<((The Broken Bull))>>, after talking with the tech about the problem he decided to trouble shoot further in the direction of the wiring for the solenoid “C”. I could tell that he was not happy with himself in not being able to fix the issue. We have all been there, sleepless nights…waking up in the middle of an early morning with that nagging problem that just wouldn’t go away…coming up with an idea to trouble-shoot or fix the problem while you are in the shower getting ready for work…Yes any tech forth his salt will experience the above with out a doubt. It just goes to show us that we are caring individuals. As such the tech figured out a way to duplicate the problem…Guess what he did?

Alright I’ll tell you. All because it is something I thing every bull owner ought to be aware of especially if you are experiencing my problem: “NO REVERSE AND A FAULY CODE P0760”. Just to make a long story short, a ground activates these solenoids and there is power to them all the time. The Tech opened up the wiring harness to gain access to the wire that actives “C” every time he grounded the wire he got no reverse and the P0760 fault code. So some where in the harness is a bad spot that is chaffing on the wire. He said it was in the harness internal to the transmission were it was bad. So there you have it ladies and gentlemen, you get no reverse and the P0760 fault code. Problem solved. The Tech is a happy man and he will sleep 100% better tonight. And now I am a happy Bull owner.



Once again thanks for all your input and responses I look forward to posting more on your forum.

I think my next mod might be a trany cooler for the <<((THE BROKEN BULL))>> before any other major trany problems occur.

What other mods can be done to the AX4S/ AXODE trans axle?

Thanks again ALL.

<<((The Broken BULL))>> rides again,
Tom
Interesting! Thanks for posting the result. I saw a place inside where the wires could chafe. I placed a wire tie there to prevent it. I rebuilt mine with upgrades. The story is in the following links:

http://www.taurusclub.com/forum/87-engine-drivetrain/156628-transmission-fluid-leak.html

http://www.taurusclub.com/forum/82-maintenance-repair/156770-if-has-come-out.html
 

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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
WOW egiroux,

I just got through reading your endeavors. I just got to say...YOU ARE THE MAN!!!

I just pick up my car this afternoon. I have always been light on the foot ever since the first rebuild. The bull seams to drive a bit different than what I remember. Of course I have been driving the wife's mini van since mine has been in the shop, maybe that has something to do with it. I bring this up because it seams to be shifting smoother than what I remembered. I'll have to pay more attention tomorrow going into work.

It is nice to do things yourself. I remember when I was younger I did a C6 trany in my old '67 Fairlane, talking about having to have long arms to reach way down to the reverse sprag, but that's another story.

I’ll look into those MOD’s especially to the valve body after the holidays, along with the cooler and synthetic ATF. That Fan mod seams like I good idea too.

Great job on the trany rebuild.

<<((THE BROKEN BULL))>> rides again
tom
 

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Thanks Tomtaurus. I would definitely start with the cooler. If you keep the A/C on whenever it's warm outside the fan will run and accomplish the same thing I did with the temp switch. Good luck with the mod's you choose-you can only improve on Ford's marginal design.
 
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