Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum banner
1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hey folks need some help.

Several weeks ago my 06 (3.0 not flex fuel) acted like it ran out of fuel. Then it would crank but not start after sitting in car line waiting for my son. I didn't think I could hear the fuel pump running at all so did some banging and after about 45 minutes while waiting on a friend I tried again, heard the fuel pump kick on and it fired up.

Replaced the fuel pump and filter (nightmare town tbh due to a previous guy changing it and breaking all the fuel line clips and cross-threading a rear fuel tank strap bolt). Thought the problem was solved.

Fast forward a week later. I take my son to breakfast and after driving him home to get stuff for school the car will crank but not start. I could hear the fuel pump running but it was acting like it wasn't getting any gas. After about 45 minutes to an hour, it fires right up like no problem.

This same thing has happened now a few times. I have changed the temp control sensor and thought it fixed it. Nope.

It has spark, plenty of power but will not fire. After waiting 30-45 minutes it fires right up. I'd love some suggestions of where to look next. I have a fuel pressure gauge but can't find the schraeder valve to check.

Help!!

Thanks.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
36 Posts

Here is another informative post just in case you don't have a valve.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,587 Posts
I had two 2001s that did the same thing and had to wait for the pump to do "something" and then it would restart. How many miles? The fuel flex makes things a little more complex and it has an interim module that is not in the normal fuel car. I think it was for the fuel gauge but not sure. Not sure what the temperature thing you talked about.

O6 just has a data point on the computer to read pressure. I have a 06. Maybe there is an adapter to install to connect the pressure gauge.

A shot of starting fluid into the snorkel and trying to start it will help confirm

How is your battery?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,188 Posts
I had two 2001s that did the same thing and had to wait for the pump to do "something" and then it would restart. How many miles? The fuel flex makes things a little more complex and it has an interim module that is not in the normal fuel car. I think it was for the fuel gauge but not sure. Not sure what the temperature thing you talked about.

O6 just has a data point on the computer to read pressure. I have a 06. Maybe there is an adapter to install to connect the pressure gauge.

A shot of starting fluid into the snorkel and trying to start it will help confirm

How is your battery?
FP is available at the OBDII. Just need a reader. Mine charted from my "Carchip". Sidebar here, note the PCM jumps the pressure up when cold start.
-chart-
 

Attachments

·
Registered
Joined
·
542 Posts
So to get this straight:

The engine is warm and the car runs without problems, you stop the car, switch off the engine, 5 minutes later you try to start it, the engine cranks alright but does not start. Yet 45 minutes later the engine starts without a problem, right?

That is very odd. I'd say that cannot be the fuel or the sparks because the problem should already be there when the car was warm idling. That only leaves the air intake. It also cannot be the IAC valve because the engine would not idle properly. Perhaps the air filter is so clogged that you really need a running engine to suck in enough air and when the engine is cold (after 45 minutes) the PCM adds so much gas, the engine has to start (as Automender suggested).
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,188 Posts
So to get this straight:

The engine is warm and the car runs without problems, you stop the car, switch off the engine, 5 minutes later you try to start it, the engine cranks alright but does not start. Yet 45 minutes later the engine starts without a problem, right?

That is very odd. I'd say that cannot be the fuel or the sparks because the problem should already be there when the car was warm idling. That only leaves the air intake. It also cannot be the IAC valve because the engine would not idle properly. Perhaps the air filter is so clogged that you really need a running engine to suck in enough air and when the engine is cold (after 45 minutes) the PCM adds so much gas, the engine has to start (as Automender suggested).
I had this one time on '95 Essex. Was the fuel pump. When hot it leaked the fuel down. Then the pump did not want to start when hot. After a bit of rest and cooling. Pump ran and got the fuel going again. Once started, it ran fine.
-chart-
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
7,587 Posts
So to get this straight:

The engine is warm and the car runs without problems, you stop the car, switch off the engine, 5 minutes later you try to start it, the engine cranks alright but does not start. Yet 45 minutes later the engine starts without a problem, right?

That is very odd. I'd say that cannot be the fuel or the sparks because the problem should already be there when the car was warm idling. That only leaves the air intake. It also cannot be the IAC valve because the engine would not idle properly. Perhaps the air filter is so clogged that you really need a running engine to suck in enough air and when the engine is cold (after 45 minutes) the PCM adds so much gas, the engine has to start (as Automender suggested).
I had this happen many times on both my 2001s and replacing fuel pumps cured the problem on both of them. I thought it was a thermal protection but it isn't. Not sure what it is. My former boss and I was traveling on the Ohio turnpike with me following him. He had a 1990 Taurus and had the same history of stalling. He the engine stopped running in a construction zone and I came up behind him and pushed him through. Just at the end of the construction zone he tried to start the engine and it started. Fuel pump solved his problem. Not saying it is without further testing but I have seen it fix the same problem three times. The fuel pump control module could also be the issue along with bad grounds and high resistance power connections.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,188 Posts
I had this happen many times on both my 2001s and replacing fuel pumps cured the problem on both of them. I thought it was a thermal protection but it isn't. Not sure what it is. My former boss and I was traveling on the Ohio turnpike with me following him. He had a 1990 Taurus and had the same history of stalling. He the engine stopped running in a construction zone and I came up behind him and pushed him through. Just at the end of the construction zone he tried to start the engine and it started. Fuel pump solved his problem. Not saying it is without further testing but I have seen it fix the same problem three times. The fuel pump control module could also be the issue along with bad grounds and high resistance power connections.
The Module began in '02. Earlier used battery volts to the pump. With the FPDM, it measures current draw and if it draws too much current, it just quits. My '03 Sable wagon did that. No pump run. Code is that of "out of gas". I hot wired it and the pump ran and I drove it to a shop and got a pump installed. With the hot wire, OBDII showed 80# pressure. That is the over pressure bypass in the tank is supposed to relieve the pressure to prevent damage.
-chart-
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
So to get this straight:

The engine is warm and the car runs without problems, you stop the car, switch off the engine, 5 minutes later you try to start it, the engine cranks alright but does not start. Yet 45 minutes later the engine starts without a problem, right?

That is very odd. I'd say that cannot be the fuel or the sparks because the problem should already be there when the car was warm idling. That only leaves the air intake. It also cannot be the IAC valve because the engine would not idle properly. Perhaps the air filter is so clogged that you really need a running engine to suck in enough air and when the engine is cold (after 45 minutes) the PCM adds so much gas, the engine has to start (as Automender suggested).
Thanks! I will double check the air filter. I was thinking thermal related which is why I changed the temp control sensor (and I didn't think my fans were running correctly). I didn't know the PCM would add that much more gas.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
I will see what I can do to get hold of a scanner to see fuel pressure. There are no codes set which seems really odd to me with all the sensors. I'll update when I get a chance! Really appreciate all the help.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
11,188 Posts
I will see what I can do to get hold of a scanner to see fuel pressure. There are no codes set which seems really odd to me with all the sensors. I'll update when I get a chance! Really appreciate all the help.
I had bad misfire on '05 DOHC. No codes. Found "pending code" for #3 cylinder for misfire. Got a coil from JY and it fixed that. Hard to believe serious misfire did not set a code.
PENDING CODE. Others taught me this on this post.
-chart-
 

·
Registered
2002 Taurus Wagon, 3.0L V6 OHV, Automatic, only 78K miles, former fleet vehicle
Joined
·
2 Posts
It has spark, plenty of power but will not fire. After waiting 30-45 minutes it fires right up. I'd love some suggestions of where to look next. I have a fuel pressure gauge but can't find the schraeder valve to check.
This sounds very similar to what my 2002 OHC Taurus wagon (low mileage at only 75K, if it matters) did. I think it MAY now be fixed -- after replacing coil, plugs, plug wires, and mass airflow sensor to no avail.

It was always fine cold but then would fail after I had driven long enough to fully warm it up, then turned it off for say 15 minutes (give or take). At that point it would run very rough at idle or even stall -- BUT be okay if I could coax it out onto the road and get going above idle -- or, alternately, if I let it cool down for 45 minutes to an hour. The FIXD device I got in an effort to figure out what was going on (since the shop could never get it to fail) would throw misfire codes on various cylinders. Then after replacing the mass airflow sensor, it started throwing both misfire codes and lean mix codes.

My mechanics could never get it to fail (although I always could, if I paid attention to the timing... I suspect they weren't paying attention to what I told them about the timing of when it failed). Finally I arranged with them to let me bring it in at a set time and get it to fail for them. At that point, on their scope, it showed barometric pressure as if it was at altitude (though it was actually close to sea level), as well as some other oddities (e.g. their scope thought it was a 2008 and couldn't read the VIN).

What they did, which SEEMS* to have finally fixed it, was to disconnect the wiring harness to the ECM. They said it had a lot of what they called "pixie dust" (apparently aluminum dust?) potentially interfering with the connections. They cleaned that all off and apparently treated the connections with what they called a dielectric, though I don't know what product that would have been exactly.

They called me a couple of days ago to say that someone with a 1997 Ford truck had come in with the exact same symptoms (though sounding more severe than mine), and they did the same thing with his PCM connectors. They said he had reported back that that fixed his truck. Which does move my optimism level up a couple of notches that this fix MIGHT hold.

If you try that, I'd love to hear back about your results!

p.s. The first time I tried to get it to fail after picking it up, I felt like it was thinking about failing. I then did this protocol to reset the PCM: Resetting the PCM after Repairs are made I'm not sure if that made any difference or not. I've been fighting this problem for over a year now, so there's a good possibility that I'm hypersensitive about when it's "thinking" about failing.

* I'm not declaring victory yet, because it has been pretty clear to me that the failure had to be temperature related, since It's been unusually cold here (Washington State), so it's possible that's why the problem seemed to go away after this last thing with the computer connections.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top