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-   -   2007 ford taurus intermittent stalling and intermittent rough idle. (https://www.taurusclub.com/forum/82-maintenance-repair/348123-2007-ford-taurus-intermittent-stalling-intermittent-rough-idle.html)

Stephen Pump 12-03-2018 05:04 PM

2007 ford taurus intermittent stalling and intermittent rough idle.
 
So i bought a Ford Taurus 2007, 168,000 miles. Replaced MAF. Smelled of gas at first, ran crc treatment to the intake, then followed it up with seafoam intake cleaner next day. This did not resolve but made the car run a bit smoother. Went through the coil pack unplugging one by one, discovered a coil not firing. replaced the coil pack and spark plugs (they were pretty fouled), this made it run smoother. Then because of the o2 sensor code, i replaced bank 2 sensor 1, and same code persisted. I bought a live data code scanner, apparently the volt is stuck at 0.01. So tomorrow I will probe it and send some power to it and see if it shows volt to the live data, if not then its a bad harness. I also replaced the fuel filter. I also get intermittent check charging system, then i notice the erratic idle happens a lot of times right at that point and usually stalls. Checked charging from alternator and drop test, all within spec. I have also smoke tested it and the only viable smoke was from the EGR. I also sucked on the tube that connects to the EGR nipple and verified it was working as it stalled the car. I do have a pending cam sensor code, I do not have any chirping the cam synchronizer. I also took out the IAC and cleaned it, and replaced it with a new gasket. I am attaching a video from the live data, maybe someone will find it useful to help me figure this problem out. So any input would be nice. Thanks in advance.

ice445 12-04-2018 02:38 AM

A couple things are probably going on here. For starters, the car is running pretty rich, as you could already tell. Likely due to the bank 1 sensor 2 output being stuck lean. The computer uses the upstream sensor to assess the mixture and set the trims, so no surprise there that it's trending rich. Second, what was your voltage reading at the battery with every accessory turned on? The car is showing in the 11V range which would indicate a bad alt or corroded charging wire. And third, just because the camshaft synchronizer isn't squeaking doesn't mean it doesn't need replacement. They can wobble and shave the sensor down and give erratic readings to the computer. I would definitely suspect some electrical issues going on here. How old is the battery?

Automender12345 12-04-2018 09:29 AM

Camshaft sensor times the fuel injection so fuel may not be injecting into open intake valves.


I actually had a camshaft sensor go bad with out it being the mechanical synchronizer.

Stephen Pump 12-04-2018 01:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ice445 (Post 3447013)
A couple things are probably going on here. For starters, the car is running pretty rich, as you could already tell. Likely due to the bank 1 sensor 2 output being stuck lean. The computer uses the upstream sensor to assess the mixture and set the trims, so no surprise there that it's trending rich. Second, what was your voltage reading at the battery with every accessory turned on? The car is showing in the 11V range which would indicate a bad alt or corroded charging wire. And third, just because the camshaft synchronizer isn't squeaking doesn't mean it doesn't need replacement. They can wobble and shave the sensor down and give erratic readings to the computer. I would definitely suspect some electrical issues going on here. How old is the battery?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Automender12345 (Post 3447039)
Camshaft sensor times the fuel injection so fuel may not be injecting into open intake valves.


I actually had a camshaft sensor go bad with out it being the mechanical synchronizer.

No clue on the battery, came with the car, but advanceauto and walmart it checked out as a good battery, like 800 cold cracking amps. Checked battery was 12.2 before start, after start it remained around 14.5. checked ohm of the camsensor, its around 500 resistance, spec is 250-1000 from reading. Have not unplugged the o2 sensor as i dont feel like crawling under the car its about 25F outside lol and not including the windchill.
Thanks for the input its appreciated, any further ideas?


Automender12345 12-04-2018 04:28 PM

Resistance is not a goog measure for the sensor. Believe it is a Hall Effects semi conductor that is activated by the metal tooth on the mechanical drive.

Stephen Pump 12-04-2018 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Automender12345 (Post 3447093)
Resistance is not a goog measure for the sensor. Believe it is a Hall Effects semi conductor that is activated by the metal tooth on the mechanical drive.

Thanks, I plan to take off the sensor tomorrow, i found a good youtube video reference, but mainly will be looking for scratches on the sensor or play in the synchronizer itself. Think that's a fair assesment?

Jeff K 12-05-2018 06:58 AM

2 types of sensors used over the years. Hall switch (3 wire) sensor or VR sensor (2 wire) Hall switch can not be tested with ohmmeter. Ohms will give you limited info (open or shorted) on the health of a VR (Variable Reluctance) sensor.

Automender12345 12-05-2018 07:09 AM

Seems logical but it doesn't account for a failed or noisy sensor. Didn't think they were that expensive to just replace. With the headache they are to reach because of the wiring harness, I would switch it out. Have you had a chirping sound coming from that area?

Stephen Pump 12-06-2018 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Automender12345 (Post 3447123)
Seems logical but it doesn't account for a failed or noisy sensor. Didn't think they were that expensive to just replace. With the headache they are to reach because of the wiring harness, I would switch it out. Have you had a chirping sound coming from that area?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff K (Post 3447119)
2 types of sensors used over the years. Hall switch (3 wire) sensor or VR sensor (2 wire) Hall switch can not be tested with ohmmeter. Ohms will give you limited info (open or shorted) on the health of a VR (Variable Reluctance) sensor.

Thanks for the information. I unplugged the cam sensor and started the vehicle, I seen no difference in behavior with or without it plugged in. Am going to check the key on volts at the harness, from reading the service manual, says it should be 1 volt, if less then you have a short. Do you think its necessary to unplug the pcm to perform this test?

Stephen Pump 12-06-2018 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stephen Pump (Post 3447217)
Thanks for the information. I unplugged the cam sensor and started the vehicle, I seen no difference in behavior with or without it plugged in. Am going to check the key on volts at the harness, from reading the service manual, says it should be 1 volt, if less then you have a short. Do you think its necessary to unplug the pcm to perform this test?

Ok tested both to battery negative both have .3 to .4v with key on and fluctuates between that with car running... So open circuit it seems?


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