My new Bull - Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum
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post #1 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-16-2016, 11:09 PM Thread Starter
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My new Bull

Ok firstly....excuse me if this is being posted in the wrong place. i browsed the forums looking for a suitable spot and wasn't sure wheather to post in General or the bull stable.

Anyway. anyone who's followed my last post knows i had a Car Accident on the 5th that unfortunately brought an end to my bull (1999 Ford Taurus SE) though i believe the car may actually still Run the front end was pretty messed up so i was doubting if it was worth saving.

so i went car shopping Today. and what stands out to me of course at a lot we went to was a 2005 Ford Taurus. without a price tag. they were negotiable on the price & eventually the Taurus was bought for 2500 & that includes everything. test drove the car & all was well....except for a few nagging issues which ill explain below.

The Good.

The car runs & drives fine.....the Vulcan V6 has fine power off the line & when passing....it's quiter & somewhat smoother running than the Vulcan in my other Taurus. the transmission shifts relatively smoothly & Quicker than the Transmission in my last bull. (i had got used to the somewhat lazy shifts of that one)

the exterior of the car is in OK shape. save for a few Flaws....like a Cracked side mirror housing that appears to have some sort of glue or resin bonding it. and various body dings.

the interior of the car is also in decent shape....some paint is wearing off some plastic pieces but that seems like normal wear.


Now.....to those issues i mentioned before....the car's already purchased so whatever issues present....im going to tackle them.

1. The center display in the instrument panel say's "Check Charging System" & at night you can see the battery light is actually lit but it appears someone TRIED to paint over it so it wouldn't Show (Great right?)

2. The Engine seems to have a bit of a misfire @ Idle......as it idles abit chunky...but if you give it enough pressure on the gas to raise the idle a few hundred RPM's it smooths out....but returns when you let it return to Idle speed.

3. The Messege center displays "Low Oil Pressure" & the Low oil pressure light illuminates......this only occurs at idle speed & if you give the engine some throttle....it dissapears.

all i can say is i HOPE i didn't buy something too bad.....my 1999 Bull was relatively reliable after needing some Various repairs pretty Early into ownership.

im pretty impressed by the overall feel on the Road.

however owning two of the same Car one generation i can't help but make comparisons.

the Gen3 Tauri are roomy cars inspite of their sloping trunklid & roofline....but the increased headroom in the back seat plus bigger trunk space are definetly noticable.

The Gen4 Tauri Interior has a mix of soft touch & hard plastics in the interior as the Gen3 does...however i definetly noticed that the materials on the Gen4 look & feel cheaper than those in the Gen3...the fitment is solid its just the materials seem cheaper (Just my opinion,dont rip me a new one)

i secretly wanted a later Gen 4 Tauri for the updated Instrument panel & steering wheel (so i guess i have one)
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post #2 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-16-2016, 11:20 PM
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Probably needs an alternator (common issue on that era of Bull). As for the oil pressure light, that's somewhat worrying. Could be a partially clogged pickup tube, excessive bearing clearance, etc.


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post #3 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-16-2016, 11:43 PM Thread Starter
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it is.......every worst possible scenerio went through my Head.
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post #4 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-16-2016, 11:51 PM
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Welp, it's not likely to be something that will kill the engine any time soon. If you want, pull the oil pan and do an inspection and see if anything looks highly worn or out of spec. Actually for starters, go into engineering test mode (fun new feature you can access with these cars by holding reset and turning the key to "run" until you see engineering test mode on the display). See what the oil pressure number actually is. It shows up as "rads" and not PSI, but I'm curious as to what it is at idle. I can give you a comparison to my car. You can also see what the computer is seeing as charging voltage. If it shows a solid 13.8, that means that someone installed the wrong alternator during a previous replacement (the older style of alt had self regulation, your car is PCM regulated).

Even if it is a worst case bearing clearance issue, the engine will probably run a long time as long as you do regular oil changes. Especially if it's working normally and not making any odd noises. A replacement Vulcan is also like $300 these days too so it wouldn't be the end of the world if it needed replacement.

As for the misfires, I would start by looking and seeing if any codes are pending/stored. I would also check the plugs and plug wires, and the coil for cracks. Easy starting point.


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Last edited by ice445; 03-16-2016 at 11:53 PM.
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post #5 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-17-2016, 12:47 AM Thread Starter
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well i took the car for a quick run down the Freeway to gather some specs.

i followed the procedure to put the IC in "Engineering Test Mode"

i Took care to note the displayed battery Voltage as well as the Oil Pressure.

the Battery Voltage reads 12.1 Volts with the Car not running.....with the car running the battery Voltage maintained 14.5-14.6 Volts....which is quite abit over 13.8

The Oil Pressure light did not come on this drive....despite bringing the car to opperating temp. throughout the Drive the oil pressure maintained 232-234 RADS.

however i will be watching to see if the light comes on & at what pressure reads when the Oil Light Activates.
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post #6 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-18-2016, 04:26 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ice445 View Post
Welp, it's not likely to be something that will kill the engine any time soon. If you want, pull the oil pan and do an inspection and see if anything looks highly worn or out of spec. Actually for starters, go into engineering test mode (fun new feature you can access with these cars by holding reset and turning the key to "run" until you see engineering test mode on the display). See what the oil pressure number actually is. It shows up as "rads" and not PSI, but I'm curious as to what it is at idle. I can give you a comparison to my car. You can also see what the computer is seeing as charging voltage. If it shows a solid 13.8, that means that someone installed the wrong alternator during a previous replacement (the older style of alt had self regulation, your car is PCM regulated).

Even if it is a worst case bearing clearance issue, the engine will probably run a long time as long as you do regular oil changes. Especially if it's working normally and not making any odd noises. A replacement Vulcan is also like $300 these days too so it wouldn't be the end of the world if it needed replacement.

As for the misfires, I would start by looking and seeing if any codes are pending/stored. I would also check the plugs and plug wires, and the coil for cracks. Easy starting point.

Ok took the car out for a longer drive....Oil Light comes whenever im coming to a Stop & the RPM's drop to Idle speed.

Again.....the Light will go off if i pick RPM's back up enough to generate Oil Pressure....this seems to only happen when the engine is compleatly warmed up & Only at Idle Speed.

Reguarding the Oil Pressure in the center display.....upon further research i discovered that the sensor is only really an oil pressure switch....232-234 Rad when the light is off....and drops to 0 Rad which then triggers the Oil Light seconds later.
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post #7 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-18-2016, 04:29 PM
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Welp, guess you can take the oil pan off and see if anything stands out. Id just live with it though. Warm idle results in the lowest engine speed and thus pressure. Its probably barely below the switch threshold. Im fairly sure it wont grenade, many people have had this issue.

Oh, you can also try putting 5W30 in it and see if it stops. Totally safe to do so.

As for the charging system light, I'm not sure why it's lit if you're seeing that kind of generator voltage. What happens if you turn on every accessory except rear defrost (headlights and blower on high)? If it drops below 13.5 there's a problem. That may be why it's lit. The cluster should have also logged a DTC code which will tell you what condition it saw that lit the lamp. Engineering test mode or a scanner can show you those codes.

Last edited by ice445; 03-18-2016 at 08:22 PM.
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post #8 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-19-2016, 08:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 99Bluebull View Post
Ok took the car out for a longer drive....Oil Light comes whenever im coming to a Stop & the RPM's drop to Idle speed.

Again.....the Light will go off if i pick RPM's back up enough to generate Oil Pressure....this seems to only happen when the engine is compleatly warmed up & Only at Idle Speed.

Reguarding the Oil Pressure in the center display.....upon further research i discovered that the sensor is only really an oil pressure switch....232-234 Rad when the light is off....and drops to 0 Rad which then triggers the Oil Light seconds later.
It's been some years since I had an engine that did this. Sounds like the on board electronics isn't going to be much help. You could go get a mechanical oil pressure gauge and a suitable T fitting (so that you can retain the oil pressure switch.) Hook it all up and see what your hot idle pressure is. On my old Toyota, it was the crank journals and bearings-slow death for an engine.Yours could also be bad cam journals and bearings.

As someone else pointed out, used Vulcans are so cheap and plentiful, it doesn't pay to even consider rebuilding. They are not easy to remove and reinstall, tho. And if you have to pay someone to do the work, it probably is cost prohibitive. I did the engine on my 01 and it was an adventure. Replaced a 212,000 mi. engine with one that only had 110,000*. The engine isn't all I replace--new engine, trannie, and dogbone parts, all the hoses, the radiator and thermostat, and a bunch of suspension parts. I'm pretty happy with the results.

If you can't manage the work yourself, find a low income person to do the work. I don't mean this in a racist way, but here in Tucson, there are a variety of extremely talented Hispanic mechanics. My Hispanic nephew (in Reno) can even rebuild automatic transmissions.

It can be done in a carport, but it's an adventure,

*I got mine at a wrecking yard and it came with a one year warranty, steam cleaned, compression readings, and an oil pressure reading. It was a lot more than $300.

2001 SES Wagon. 210k and strong running.

Last edited by Brian in Tucson; 03-19-2016 at 09:02 AM.
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post #9 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-19-2016, 08:54 AM
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A question, and you don't have to answer if you don't feel like it. What did you pay for this heap (kidding.)

2001 SES Wagon. 210k and strong running.
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post #10 of 19 (permalink) Old 03-19-2016, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ice445 View Post
Probably needs an alternator (common issue on that era of Bull). As for the oil pressure light, that's somewhat worrying. Could be a partially clogged pickup tube, excessive bearing clearance, etc.
Being a Vulcan the FIRST thing I would suspect is the cam synchro, and move on from there.


Is there any chirping at idle? Also what do the RPM's drop to at idle because if it's too low, there might not be enough rpm to effectively have enough oil pressure which would trip the light. Same goes for the alternator. Do you have an ELM and Forscan? If not, get one because that will give you MUCH more information about the car and what it's doing than the information center. I would also hook it up to a scanner now, just to be certain that there were no codes, or pending codes, having the possibility of the CEL light being blown out. If you turn the key to on(do not start it) does the CEL go on, then shut off after a couple seconds? You'd be surprised at what dealers do to get a car pushed off their lots....... Is there any warranty with this car being that you bought it from a lot? I would be bringing it back to them for the money you paid.


Can you take a video of the car running at cold and warm idle then post it? That would help.


I'm going to be honest with you as I'm not into sugar coating things...... I think you got hosed for $2500. The check charging system, and oil light would have made me run fast and hard away from it at that price knowing the possibilities of the issues and knowing there are others out there that are mostly sound drivers at that price.
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