06 Montego - Fuel Delivery Issue - Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum
 3Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 09:57 AM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Rep Power: 0
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
06 Montego - Fuel Delivery Issue

This one has the local mechanics stumped. Not willing to pay dealer rates for diagnosis yet, so I'm looking for some help here.

The car died sitting at a light one day - would crank but not start. Police pushed it off to the side of the road. Waited for a tow. By the time the tow arrived, it magically started up and they drove it on and off the flatbed. Started once in the driveway but then not again. After a lot of troubleshooting, and verification that the fuel pump was not running, we replaced the fuel pump. Still wouldn't start, stored a P0191 code.

Bypassed the intertia switch and it fired right up. But there is still a problem but the symptoms are slightly different, persistent P0191 code and now a P0174 (lean) code.

There's a hesitation off idle and it's a bit lethargic at random. After driving for a period of time, it will not restart unless you let it sit for at least a few hours. We replaced the fuel pressure/temp sensor to no avail. The car does have a fuel pump driver module mounted to the RH C-pillar, though few parts sites list one for this car. We were thinking of replacing that next, but there is one odd symptom that we can't figure out. When it's cranking and not starting the pump is definitely running. If we crack open a line we'll get a blast of air, then fuel, and then it will run. It does this when it's cold so it's not vapor lock.

Where could it be getting air from? There are no EVAP codes, though the EVAP monitor may not have run yet given the fact that we haven't been able to drive it much because of these fuel issues.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated!
turbojimmy is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 10:12 AM
Crazy Devoted Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Chapter: Midwest
Year: 1998
Model: Mercury Sable
Engine: 3.0L 24v Duratec V6
Posts: 22,250
Rep Power: 112
     
Trader Score: 1 reviews
Has the ckp sensor and its wiring been checked?
sheila is online now  
post #3 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 10:17 AM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Rep Power: 0
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
Thanks for the reply Sheila.

No, we haven't checked that since the codes and symptoms are pointing to fuel delivery. Not that the ckp isn't involved in all that, but it's the air in the lines that really have us stumped. I'll take a look at it though.
turbojimmy is offline  
 
post #4 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 12:37 PM
Crazy Devoted Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Chapter: Midwest
Year: 1998
Model: Mercury Sable
Engine: 3.0L 24v Duratec V6
Posts: 22,250
Rep Power: 112
     
Trader Score: 1 reviews
My middle son had the exact same symptoms on his '06 500 several years ago. His was intermittent though. Took it to a reputable local shop that kept it for several days to a week trying to diagnose but couldn't. They apologized and told him to come and pick up the car. No charge. Car's been running fine since he brought it home??? Keep us (me) updated please.
sheila is online now  
post #5 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 02:33 PM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Rep Power: 0
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by sheila View Post
My middle son had the exact same symptoms on his '06 500 several years ago. His was intermittent though. Took it to a reputable local shop that kept it for several days to a week trying to diagnose but couldn't. They apologized and told him to come and pick up the car. No charge. Car's been running fine since he brought it home??? Keep us (me) updated please.
The problem is that it's intermittent so not only do we have a hard time duplicating it, there's no set pattern that would point to anything specific. At first we thought it was doing it when it was hot, then it started doing it cold. Then we thought we had to wait a few hours, but then this morning it wouldn't start after sitting overnight. There's no rhyme or reason.

We're going to replace the inertia switch anyway - the date code is on the "bad" list according to a TSB on the matter. But it still misbehaves with it completely bypassed so I doubt that's the problem. Like I said before, the air in the line is puzzling. The only thing I can think of is that maybe the original problem was the intertia switch, but we replaced the fuel pump not knowing any better. Maybe we goofed that up somehow? There are two internal and 2 external connections on the pump. Pretty straightforward push-n-lock fittings. Kind of tough to mess up.

I'll let you know if/when we figure it out.
sheila likes this.
turbojimmy is offline  
post #6 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-20-2018, 08:18 PM
Member
 
Jim Beckett's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Lake Oswego, OR
Chapter: Pacific Northwest
Year: 2004
Model: Ford Taurus
Engine: 3.0L 12v Vulcan V6
Posts: 110
Rep Power: 2
 
Garage
Trader Score: 0 reviews
I think you probably know more about this than I do, but sometimes a nudge from a noob helps...

P0191 - Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor Circuit Range/Performance

Maybe you purchased a defective replacement fuel pressure/temp sensor? (My gut says you were on the right track with this part.)

Could a cut/defective o-ring on this part explain air getting back into the fuel system? You would think you'd notice a fuel leak around this, though.

Also, was wondering if perhaps the fuel pump you installed could account for the same. Maybe it is bypassing/leaking internally in the fuel tank?

I think you effectively ruled out the inertia switch, but a new one couldn't hurt if it is on the TSB suspect list.

I'm that guy. Don't be that guy.
Jim Beckett is offline  
post #7 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 08:09 AM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Rep Power: 0
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Beckett View Post
I think you probably know more about this than I do, but sometimes a nudge from a noob helps...

P0191 - Fuel Rail Pressure Sensor Circuit Range/Performance

Maybe you purchased a defective replacement fuel pressure/temp sensor? (My gut says you were on the right track with this part.)

Could a cut/defective o-ring on this part explain air getting back into the fuel system? You would think you'd notice a fuel leak around this, though.

Also, was wondering if perhaps the fuel pump you installed could account for the same. Maybe it is bypassing/leaking internally in the fuel tank?

I think you effectively ruled out the inertia switch, but a new one couldn't hurt if it is on the TSB suspect list.
We thought maybe the new pressure sensor might be bad so we swapped it with the old one. Didn't fix it.

I think we've ruled out the intertia switch, too, but my dad is hell bent on replacing it anyway.

My dad took it to another mechanic yesterday who was kind enough to offer some free advice. He said to put a hair dryer up to the fuel pump driver module while it's running to see if it quits. It did. The theory now is that the fuel pump driver module intermittently isn't commanding the pump to run fast enough to properly pressurize the system, and quits completely when it gets hot. The very first failure was on a very hot day. For some reason my nephew (it's his car) doesn't use air conditioning and the car has a black interior. Gets very hot inside. Despite this, my dad is going with the intertia switch first. If I were a betting man, I'd say that we'll be ordering a fuel pump driver module in a couple of days after we realize the intertia switch didn't fix it.

Or...like you say it could be a bad, new pump module. I installed it and it looked correct and in tact but you never know.
turbojimmy is offline  
post #8 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 04:38 PM
Member
 
Join Date: May 2018
Posts: 233
Rep Power: 3
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
I think you found the problem. Let your dad do what he wants. He's just trying to help.
46davis is offline  
post #9 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-21-2018, 05:00 PM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Rep Power: 0
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
Quote:
Originally Posted by 46davis View Post
I think you found the problem. Let your dad do what he wants. He's just trying to help.
I know he's trying to help. I just hate to see him waste his money on replacing good parts.

So, he replaced the inertia switch today. Started it up, put it in drive and it stalled and wouldn't start. He bypassed and it's fine again (fine as in it runs, but still has the prior symptoms). Ordered the fuel pump driver module from Ford. We'll see how that goes...
sheila likes this.
turbojimmy is offline  
post #10 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-24-2018, 10:16 AM Thread Starter
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Posts: 12
Rep Power: 0
 
Trader Score: 0 reviews
So the fuel pump driver module didn't fix it. Everything has been replaced now except the fuel tank pressure sensor. I guess we're going to do that next.
turbojimmy is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.

User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in










Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
93 octane appears to elminate misses at idle. What (if anything) does this mean? Queequeg152 Maintenance and Repair 48 06-16-2018 05:10 AM
quick questions regarding 2000 taurus fuel pump assembly. Queequeg152 Maintenance and Repair 7 12-18-2017 06:54 PM
05 Murcury Montego fuel pouring out Ttppss24 Maintenance and Repair 0 12-09-2015 12:19 PM
Help with crank/no start please? Green Country Maintenance and Repair 15 01-10-2015 08:22 AM
fuel pump issue? ford1998taurussedohc Maintenance and Repair 32 04-07-2013 03:03 PM

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome