06 Montego - Fuel Delivery Issue - Page 2 - Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum
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post #11 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-24-2018, 11:15 AM
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So the fuel pump driver module didn't fix it. Everything has been replaced now except the fuel tank pressure sensor. I guess we're going to do that next.
Man, you're going through the wringer on this one. Please let us know what does fix it.

I've been working with a guy with a problem like this on a Mercedes for months. It's out of warranty and the dealer says don't bring it back. Heard today he has a buyer for it.
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post #12 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-24-2018, 11:54 AM
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Fuel tank pressure sensor is only related to monitoring air pressure in the tank for the EVAP system. You can take the sensor out, throw it in the garbage, and it will have no effect on pump or engine performance, other than a CEL for the EVAP system.

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post #13 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-24-2018, 12:13 PM Thread Starter
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Fuel tank pressure sensor is only related to monitoring air pressure in the tank for the EVAP system. You can take the sensor out, throw it in the garbage, and it will have no effect on pump or engine performance, other than a CEL for the EVAP system.
I know. Try telling that to my dad The P0191 persists. He put the original fuel pressure/temp sensor back in and it wouldn't run at all. I don't know if that's a clue or not.

I don't know where the air is coming from but it's definitely what's killing it. When it dies you have to let it sit for a few hours before it will restart. But if you open up the fuel rail to bleed the air out it will start and run again for a while until enough air gets in there for it to quit again. Sometimes it's only a few minutes, other times you can drive it for miles and miles. It only happens when it's idling, which is exactly when it quit the first time - idling at a light. It's like vapor lock but it's not from getting too hot. It's behaving exactly like it did the day it was towed so I don't think it's related to our work in replacing the pump module. We're going to pull it back out and check it anyway.
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post #14 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-24-2018, 08:54 PM
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You know this doesn't make any sense at all, don't you? The **** thing ought to run.
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post #15 of 22 (permalink) Old 08-25-2018, 10:02 AM
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I'm a GM mechanic, so I may be talking out my backside. But I would be checking the fuel pressure regulator.

But the other thing that has me curious is the fuel rail having air in it. These fuel systems should have a return fuel line going to the tank. This fuel return is what stops air from getting trapped in the fuel rail.

For me, it sounds like either the return fuel line is clogged, or the regulator is stuck, not allowing fuel to return.

Just my 2 cents

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post #16 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-14-2018, 06:16 AM Thread Starter
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It's looking like it was the alternator. We didn't have a low battery light or any voltage related codes, but my dad noticed that the lights would flicker occasionally and my nephew (it's his car) said sometimes his cell phone wouldn't charge. My dad checked the voltage at idle and it was basically just battery - 12.2V. At 2k RPM it would go up to 14 volts. This might explain why it had a rough idle.

Our theory is that the pump wasn't maintaining enough pressure to prevent vapor lock - hence the air in the system that would stall it and keep it from restarting. While low voltage isn't in the list of things to check with the P0191 code it could theoretically cause the code if the pump isn't delivering the expected pressure.

It's only been a couple of days since he replaced the alternator (based on is description I'm glad I wasn't part of that job - doesn't sound like fun) but the car is running much better overall.
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post #17 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-14-2018, 09:21 AM
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Several years ago the wifes 04 Tec spit out a P0191. To make a long story short, the solution was a new fuel pump.

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post #18 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-14-2018, 10:20 AM Thread Starter
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I'm a GM mechanic, so I may be talking out my backside. But I would be checking the fuel pressure regulator.

But the other thing that has me curious is the fuel rail having air in it. These fuel systems should have a return fuel line going to the tank. This fuel return is what stops air from getting trapped in the fuel rail.

For me, it sounds like either the return fuel line is clogged, or the regulator is stuck, not allowing fuel to return.

Just my 2 cents
It's a return-less system. I'm a GM guy too and had never seen one before. There is no regulator per se. There's a pressure/temp sensor that feeds info to the PCM. The PCM decides the optimal fuel pressure given load, temperature, etc. and maintains that pressure by varying voltage to the fuel pump. There's no return. The air, we think, is from vapor lock. If fuel pressure is too low it will vapor lock causing the "air" which is actually fuel vapor. The issues started during some really hot days in August. The P0191 code is a generic no/too-little/too-much fuel code so we replaced everything fuel-related to no avail.


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Several years ago the wifes 04 Tec spit out a P0191. To make a long story short, the solution was a new fuel pump.
That was the first thing we did. Seemed logical but didn't fix it.

I think the new alternator fixed it. Fingers crossed. Maybe we were overlooking the obvious, but it would have been nice if the P0191 troubleshooting mentioned checking battery voltage at idle.
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post #19 of 22 (permalink) Old 09-14-2018, 11:12 AM
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^ Let us know if it "stays" fixed.
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post #20 of 22 (permalink) Old 01-09-2019, 05:37 PM Thread Starter
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^ Let us know if it "stays" fixed.
I haven't posted in a while but it didn't stay fixed. Any day we get that's above around 50 degrees it will still vapor lock. It's driving us insane. We're going to take it to the dealer along with the list of everything we've replaced to see what they can do. We don't want them to throw a bunch of parts at it like we did.
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