Oil Residue In Intake? - Page 2 - Taurus Car Club of America : Ford Taurus Forum
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post #11 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-08-2017, 01:03 PM
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Doug, front/clean line is not attached to an uim (intake) vacuum port like the rear/dirty/pcv line. Front goes from the intake snorkel/tube to the front valve/cam cover (or oil cap). There is a draw on that line toward the eng./crankcase. Clean flow enters the front and circulates throughout the eng. and pulled via vacuum out the rear along with oil vapor/fumes/crud.
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post #12 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-09-2017, 07:34 AM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sheila View Post
Doug, front/clean line is not attached to an uim (intake) vacuum port like the rear/dirty/pcv line. Front goes from the intake snorkel/tube to the front valve/cam cover (or oil cap). There is a draw on that line toward the eng./crankcase. Clean flow enters the front and circulates throughout the eng. and pulled via vacuum out the rear along with oil vapor/fumes/crud.

So in that case... Is it normal to have SOME oil residue in the front/clean line as well as the intake snorkel?
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post #13 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-09-2017, 11:03 AM
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^ "Some", if your constantly "mashing" it. Usually a sign the pcv valve/barb is at least partially plugged or its vacuum is compromised.
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Last edited by sheila; 08-09-2017 at 11:06 AM.
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post #14 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 01:13 PM
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The engine pictured is mine. The top red oval is where the PCV line connects to the intake at back of engine bay. The middle oval is the snorkel end of the hollow tube and the bottom oval is the hollow tube connection to the valve cover.

The drawing marked Original was created by someone else, I found it here: PCV system question... - V6Power Messageboard
It basically matches my engine configuration and likely billions of other cars. The drawing is same as zillions of other internet drawings explaining PCV systems. It shows a flow loop as mention previously of intake>clean>crankcase>PCV>combustion.

In the drawing marked Ver 2.0 the green is where vacuum takes place. The whole intake - snorkel, throttle, upper & lower intake manifolds - all under the same vacuum The same amount of draw toward the cylinder heads.

So, in the drawing marked Ver 3.0, if the same vacuum exists on both the PCV and that tube plumbed ahead of the throttle, why do we think air will not be flowing toward the vacuum, toward the intake. I think both lines are being sucked on by the intake as shown in brown. So I think contrary to popular legend, no real "clean air", no real loop of flow through the crankcase. Except for maybe a nano second when the throttle is being opened and perhaps there is a slight pressure difference between the PCV line and the tube ahead of the throttle. But that difference in pressure is very short lived.

All this would explain why the entire snorkel and throttle get coated in oil. It isn't only because of a bad PCV but a consistent flow of dirty air (oily air) up that front line ahead of the throttle. And seems that front line almost negates the reasoning for a PCV valve since the snorkel tube does not have any kind of a valve.
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post #15 of 21 (permalink) Old 08-11-2017, 06:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dougboffl View Post
The engine pictured is mine. The top red oval is where the PCV line connects to the intake at back of engine bay. The middle oval is the snorkel end of the hollow tube and the bottom oval is the hollow tube connection to the valve cover.

The drawing marked Original was created by someone else, I found it here: PCV system question... - V6Power Messageboard
It basically matches my engine configuration and likely billions of other cars. The drawing is same as zillions of other internet drawings explaining PCV systems. It shows a flow loop as mention previously of intake>clean>crankcase>PCV>combustion.

In the drawing marked Ver 2.0 the green is where vacuum takes place. The whole intake - snorkel, throttle, upper & lower intake manifolds - all under the same vacuum The same amount of draw toward the cylinder heads.

So, in the drawing marked Ver 3.0, if the same vacuum exists on both the PCV and that tube plumbed ahead of the throttle, why do we think air will not be flowing toward the vacuum, toward the intake. I think both lines are being sucked on by the intake as shown in brown. So I think contrary to popular legend, no real "clean air", no real loop of flow through the crankcase. Except for maybe a nano second when the throttle is being opened and perhaps there is a slight pressure difference between the PCV line and the tube ahead of the throttle. But that difference in pressure is very short lived.

All this would explain why the entire snorkel and throttle get coated in oil. It isn't only because of a bad PCV but a consistent flow of dirty air (oily air) up that front line ahead of the throttle. And seems that front line almost negates the reasoning for a PCV valve since the snorkel tube does not have any kind of a valve.
At least the first and 3rd pic are impossible. Air cannot flow from the intake to the crankcase. Vacuum in the intake. If the PCV does not function in a restricted way, the gasses in the crankcase can back flow to the accordion. There is exhaust passing the rings into the crankcase where it is supposed to be removed by the PCV along with fresh air from the downstream side of the MAF = accordion on any of mine. So, oil in the accordion can come from bad PCV or excess blowby from a bad cylinder.

All arrows to the intake point to the intake.
I did not try to look at the middle pic.
-chart-
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post #16 of 21 (permalink) Old 10-26-2017, 09:14 PM
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This thread is a couple months old but I also had oil in the intake for a while after I bought my 2013. I ended up buying an oil catch can from Ebay, mounting just forward of the coolant reservoir and running a new hose from the forward breather tube to the can. From the can it goes into the intake. Absolutely no oil in the intake after.

I've see videos on youtube that show a new model front valve cover with improved baffles to eliminate the oil in the intake.

Regardless, oil in the intake should not be considered normal. If anything it is an initial design flaw that can be corrected.
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post #17 of 21 (permalink) Old 10-30-2017, 04:03 PM
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I also had oil in the intake when i pulled it to put in new plugs. I ended up removing both the upper and lower intake and disassembling everything. I cleaned the upper and lower, throttle body, K&N intake tubing, and all connectors. This is indeed an unacceptable level of oil, likely from a little blow-by which caused the PCV to vent oil vapors into the upper intake. There was oil pooled in the upper intake and coated pretty decently in both the upper and lower. I opted to replace the PCV with a Motorcraft EV257, even though the old PCV was still functioning just fine. I picked up some oil lines at my local autoparts store and overnighted a baffled Morimoto catch can. The baffles are important as this is what separates the oil and allows clean air to be passed into the intake. Since installing the catch can and fully cleaning the entire intake assembly I have not had any oil back in the intake (going on 10,000 miles since). My mileage went up 2-3mpg after this, but this is likely due to a combination of clean air, plug change, and cleaning the intake runners all being done at the same time. Mounting your catch can between the coolant tank and the strut tower is one of the best locations as it reduces the length of hose from the PCV valve to the catch can, and also provides a straight shot back into the upper intake. It seems that the upper intake is pretty well designed, just needs to be kept clean... however, the lower intake is a choke point and would benefit from some port matching and polishing. I will be undertaking this and reporting back on the results once the weather warms up a bit, Wisconsin gets cold this time of year.
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post #18 of 21 (permalink) Old 10-31-2017, 06:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Myetball View Post
This thread is a couple months old but I also had oil in the intake for a while after I bought my 2013. I ended up buying an oil catch can from Ebay, mounting just forward of the coolant reservoir and running a new hose from the forward breather tube to the can. From the can it goes into the intake. Absolutely no oil in the intake after.

I've see videos on youtube that show a new model front valve cover with improved baffles to eliminate the oil in the intake.

Regardless, oil in the intake should not be considered normal. If anything it is an initial design flaw that can be corrected.
The 3.5's in the 2011-2014 Edge's also have a redesigned valve cover available to prevent oil from getting to the throttle body. http://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/2...e-valve-cover/

Last edited by fishx65; 10-31-2017 at 06:58 PM.
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post #19 of 21 (permalink) Old 11-30-2017, 03:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jstenold View Post
I also had oil in the intake when i pulled it to put in new plugs. I ended up removing both the upper and lower intake and disassembling everything. I cleaned the upper and lower, throttle body, K&N intake tubing, and all connectors. This is indeed an unacceptable level of oil, likely from a little blow-by which caused the PCV to vent oil vapors into the upper intake. There was oil pooled in the upper intake and coated pretty decently in both the upper and lower. I opted to replace the PCV with a Motorcraft EV257, even though the old PCV was still functioning just fine. I picked up some oil lines at my local autoparts store and overnighted a baffled Morimoto catch can. The baffles are important as this is what separates the oil and allows clean air to be passed into the intake. Since installing the catch can and fully cleaning the entire intake assembly I have not had any oil back in the intake (going on 10,000 miles since). My mileage went up 2-3mpg after this, but this is likely due to a combination of clean air, plug change, and cleaning the intake runners all being done at the same time. Mounting your catch can between the coolant tank and the strut tower is one of the best locations as it reduces the length of hose from the PCV valve to the catch can, and also provides a straight shot back into the upper intake. It seems that the upper intake is pretty well designed, just needs to be kept clean... however, the lower intake is a choke point and would benefit from some port matching and polishing. I will be undertaking this and reporting back on the results once the weather warms up a bit, Wisconsin gets cold this time of year.
jstenold,
Do you get oil or sludge in the catch can and how much of either?

I quit my catch can project I was planning because I theorized I'd need one on the front line and a separate one on the back PCV line to be truly effective. Since my 2016 is still under factory warranty, I didn't want to get into adding all those hose runs and monkeying up my engine compartment. I'm guessing mine may have the newer baffled valve cover(s) which is another reason I slowed down on the project.
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post #20 of 21 (permalink) Old 07-15-2019, 02:52 PM
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My 3.5L engine has 143,000 miles. The inside of the lower intake manifold runners are quite oily and black in color. The engine uses no oil whatsoever--Motorcraft semi synthetic 5-20. Why?
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