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Old 11-02-2012, 01:44 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Default Engine chugs after hot restart

I'm a new member I have been reading posts and have learn alot of good information,But have not found the solution to an on going problem with my 97 Taurus GL 3.0 Vulcan 189000 miles.The problem is after I drive the car and then run into a store for approx 15-20 minutes apon restart the car will chug like it has a bad miss fire and then clear up an run fine within seconds if i give it throttle it helps clear it out.
Things I have replaced
1)spark plugs and spark wires
2)fuel pump and fuel filter
3)fuel pressure regulator
4)fuel injectors all 6 (motorcraft)
5)air filter
6)coolant temp sender to computer
7)egr valve
8)changed MAF with known good one (no change)
9)checked for vacuum leaks (found none present)
10)cleaned throttle body
11)replaced IAC
12)no codes in ecu
Any ideas on what the problem is would be greatly appreciated
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Old 11-02-2012, 06:48 PM   #2 (permalink)
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Sounds alot like leaky fuel injectors. I used to own an '89 Honda Prelude that did exactly what you have described. I suppose just cause you already replaced the injectors does'nt really mean that you got all good ones. I'm not sayin thats what happened, it's just possible. I'd throw a fuel pressure tester on it and watch it when you shut it off.
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Old 11-02-2012, 08:04 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Thanks for the reply, I will throw a fuel pressure gauge on and watch for leak down with the engine off.
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:13 PM   #4 (permalink)
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hmm my 93 SHO is having this exact problem, first happened to me the other day and been happening more frequently lately, i go somewhere engine gets good and hot, and after 20 min of sitting off, it acts like it is trying to stall right after i start it, missing and trys to die, it also goes away instantly if i hit the throttle above 2k if i push it and it don't go above 2k then it goes back to running poorly! never does this when cold just when hot.
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:49 PM   #5 (permalink)
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I agree, i would perform a leak down test. Is their a return line on the fuel system? Or is it returnless? If it is a returnless system, your car should maintain 35-45 PSI for a minimum of 10 mins. Ideally, it should maintain that pressure for alot longer than 10 mins. If you have access to a scan tool such as a Snap-On Solus Pro or something that has live data monitoring capabilities, i would monitor the fuel trims and the injector pulse width. Idling warm they should be about 3.6 Pulses/ms to about 4.2 Pulses/ms. Also on live data, i would check the HO2 (oxygen) senors. Warm they should be switching from the low 100's to high 800's. I would start checking some sensor data and if everything is normal, including fuel pressure, i would maybe suspect a software issue in the PCM. But that is the last thing to replace, it would be better to get the programming updated if there is no hardware failure in the PCM
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Old 11-02-2012, 11:55 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Who has the money for a snap on solus pro? My $100 scan tool ($50 application, $50 hardware), that works with my iPad shows fuel pressure, fuel trims, etc...

Those snap-on's are nice though I must say! VERY expensive!!!

I truly doubt it is the PCM, as they don't usually go bad... I feel like people replace them before they know the actual problem.

Pretty sure the 97 was returnless, but 99% sure all ford cars were returnless by 2000.

Been reading about a lot of fuel system issues lately.

If the car sits overnight it starts up just fine, right? Cold start and no problems? Does the idle start higher than it used to (2k rpm?) or does it just jump to 1500 and then down like normal.
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Old 11-03-2012, 08:00 AM   #7 (permalink)
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97 was the "old" return type fuel system.
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Old 11-03-2012, 10:29 AM   #8 (permalink)
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If the car sits overnight it starts and idles down normal with no problem starting even after 2 hour it starts fine. this only happens after the car sits for 15-20 minutes after it is hot and yes it is a return style fuel system.
The only other problem that it was having that I failed to mention is a P0430 Catalyst System Efficiency Below Threshold (Bank 2) to solve that problem I installed an o2 extender, I dont know if this has anything to do with this problem? The o2 sensors seem to be switching normal,but they are the original ones .Could it be a coil pack or crank sensor that is heat soaking?
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Old 11-03-2012, 07:13 PM   #9 (permalink)
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I hooked up a fuel pressure gauge and let it sit for 20 minutes it was reading 30psi 20 minutes later it read 40psi this with the car shut off.
Does this make sense I guess the heat of the engine made the gauge read 10psi higher(I had the hood closed).Then I tried to start the engine it would crank and try to run but wouldnt fire the only way to make it run was stepping on the gas petal then it ran rough for a few seconds and then cleared up.I even tried cycling the key 3 times that didnt help.

Could the fuel in the fuel rail be boiling?
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Old 11-03-2012, 08:10 PM   #10 (permalink)
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well fuel has a high flash point. it doesnt boil unless it come under extreme heat, way more than your car can produce unless it is on fire lol. if you have any kind of scan tool with live data check TPS for any glitches. normally the glitch will happen at part throttle. thats where 95% of you driving is done. if it has any inaccuracies, it could cause a starting issue...

and breeves002, i didnt say go buy a solus pro! i said if he could gain access to one. maybe he knows a tech who has one. i know they are expensive. and to correct you on PCM's, they do indeed fail! be it hardware failure or software, the indeed cause all sorts of problems with cars. like i said, PCM is the last thing to check into replacing cause they can be pricey and have to be re programmed by ford for PATS...

Like jeff said, the 97 is a return type fuel system. sounds like you have good pressure to the fuel rail. a cam shaft position sensor can fail and the car would still run, although the check engine light would come on. if a crankshaft position sensor fails, the car will not run at all. the PCM has no idea where the piston position is... could be bad O2 sensors, the car does have alot of miles on it... start with the cheap things though, check for injector pulse width on hot restart, should be about 3.7 pulses/ms. could also be a intermitant IAC motor.... fords are famous for those, well everything with automatic idle control is really lol

Last edited by Geoff; 11-03-2012 at 08:13 PM.
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