02 Sensor, Bank 1 Sensor 1

[cherandy]

Hey guys, can you help clarify a few things for me?

The Sable (2003 Sable GS, Vulcan) threw a code a couple of weeks ago, I had Rodney pull it. I forget what it was, but he told me I needed to buy a new 02 sensor, bank 1 sensor 1. Something about it being lazy.

I'm looking on Ford.com and RockAuto.com and I'm not sure which I'm supposed to get since they don't say "Hey woman, this one here is bank one, sensor one. Buy this one, not that one." Motorcraft for sure, but Upstream, yes?

I'm hoping that once this is done, the loud idle at startup and occasional hiccup going down the road will cease and desist. It idles smooth and quiet after it's warmed up, but geeeyawd it's loud when it's cold. I've also noticed it has started taking just a little bit longer for the rpm's to drop below 1000 after I start it. Last Sunday, on 3 separate cold starts, the needle didn't drop below 1000 until after I'd driven it a couple of blocks and put it back in park. Probably not a big deal, really is a very small difference, it's just that I can tell they're not dropping quite as much or as fast. Replacing the sensor is likely to adjust this back to what it was, yes? I despise even the smallest of hard shifts so I sit there wasting gas warming her up, trying to be oh-so-kind to the tranny.


Also, Rodney said to buy just the one sensor, but in my 'net reading I've seen it opined that both should be done at once. Is it fine to just replace the lazy one?

And it doesn't mention number of wires on RockAuto, but I've seen 3 wires/ 4 wires specified elsewhere. ????

I clicked on the Buyer's Guide info on RockAuto, and saw this:

MERCURY SABLE (2000 - 2005)
MERCURY SABLE GS 2005

Since I have the 2003 Sable GS, and this specifies only 2005 for the GS, should I keep looking?

OHOHOH... different subject, but I'm wondering... after I had Rod replace the fuel filter, should I have disconnected the battery and done the relearn process?

Thanks for any input/info in advance.

C.

[qwertz9586]

Trim doesn't matter. Get the correct one for the engine. Bank one is the side near the firewall (windshield) and sensor 1 is the upstream sensor.

[Jeff K]

Before throwing parts at the engine, could you tell us the EXACT code? Many O2 and A/F ratio related codes (171/174 are prime examples), do NOT mean the O2 is bad, but other problems are present, and the O2 / code is trying to tell you that. My guess is that over 50% of the O2 sensors replaced are good, and the original diagnosis was incorrect.

[cherandy]

Thank you, Qwertz.

Jeff, it was P013something, I think. Sorry, the code was pulled around 2 weeks ago, so I can't remember what it is. I remember something about "lean" and "slow".

[Jeff K]

The Po13x codes do usually point to the O2 sensor or a wiring problem, like blown fuse for the O2 heater, pinched / shorted wiring, etc. (the 4th number in the code would really help!)

All narrow band O2 sensors use the same chemistry to measure oxygen content in the exhaust manifold, and no matter what the brand shown on the box, are made by Bosch, NGK, Denso and maybe one other big company. In other words, brand doesnt matter much, as long as you get one speced for your car / engine.

[cherandy]

QUOTE (Jeff K @ Mar 11 2010, 12:31 PM)

The Po13x codes do usually point to the O2 sensor or a wiring problem, like blown fuse for the O2 heater, pinched / shorted wiring, etc. (the 4th number in the code would really help!)

All narrow band O2 sensors use the same chemistry to measure oxygen content in the exhaust manifold, and no matter what the brand shown on the box, are made by Bosch, NGK, Denso and maybe one other big company. In other words, brand doesnt matter much, as long as you get one speced for your car / engine.[/b]

Jeff, I can't be positive, since I've slept at least twice since then, but I *think* it was P0133. I have hesitated to put that down since I can't remember for absolute certain.

Also, here is what Rod told me about this part, paraphrased: Stick with a Ford part on this. Aftermarket part will technically work, but there's a high failure rate in a pretty short time. He's heard stories from other mechanics and friends about it, but became a believer when he experienced it himself. Fixed someone's car by replacing the 02 sensor, and within 6 months was replacing it again. When the next one failed in under a year, got on the phone. Friend who is a mechanic at the local stealership for some 25 years now told him it's because most aftermarket parts aren't spec'd exactly the same, and so just don't last very long by comparison. Customer finally spent the extra money to get a Ford sensor, and it's still going. This was a couple of years ago.

Was planning on getting a Motorcraft sensor regardless, but when a man who frequently tells me that whatever AutoZone has is fine tells me to definitely go to the dealership for the "real thing", I won't ignore it. And no, he's not a shade-tree... he's been a reputable mechanic for somewhere around 30 years, now. More, if he's older than I think he is.

New sensor failing early won't be catastrophic like the Dorman synchronizers, but I don't intend to go through this all over again in less than a year, having wasted the cash for the part and the labor on the first go-round. Especially when I have a few dollars of tax return left and can pony up. Although I'll be doing so at RockAuto, and save around $50 or so. I haven't looked to see what the shipping charges add yet, but before tax/shipping, it's right at $50 difference between Ford.com and RockAuto.com. Haven't even called the dealership, as I'm sure they're higher regardless. Although I guess since they sent me on long break at work (after having called me in to work the day shift instead of the night shift) to cut labor, I reckon I have time. I'll do that now.

Buy Local - $113 + tax
Ford.com - $110
RockAuto - $60.80 (motorcraft)

Yep. RA it is.


I appreciate the clarification on the upstream/downstream thing. At least I know which one I should be looking at, for sure.

After the new sensor is installed, will I need to disconnect the battery and do the relearn process? Should I have done that after the fuel filter was replaced? (If so, I'll mark it in the maintenance book I'm keeping, so I'll know/remember next time around.)

[Jeff K]

Depending on what code it was exactly, (like a heater code) it will go away by itself pretty quick. Other codes may take a while. If you want it gone, just disconnect the batt for 10 min, but then you loose your radio presets, etc. Even cheap scanners let you clear codes without batt disconnect.

I bet that if you open the Motorcraft box and pull out the O2 sensor and look at it, it will say Bosch somewhere on it, as Bosch makes the sensors for Ford for nearly all their "american" engines.

[cherandy]

QUOTE (Jeff K @ Mar 11 2010, 03:37 PM)

Depending on what code it was exactly, (like a heater code) it will go away by itself pretty quick. Other codes may take a while. If you want it gone, just disconnect the batt for 10 min, but then you loose your radio presets, etc. Even cheap scanners let you clear codes without batt disconnect.

I bet that if you open the Motorcraft box and pull out the O2 sensor and look at it, it will say Bosch somewhere on it, as Bosch makes the sensors for Ford for nearly all their "american" engines.[/b]

Rod can clear codes with his scanner, I believe. I was under the impression that disconnecting the battery was needed for the car to unlearn/relearn when certain parts are changed. I just didn't know if this was one of them. Perhaps I'm remembering what I read last month incorrectly.

As for the Bosch thing... fascinating. I'll make another call to the dealership and ask him to tell me if it says Bosch on the part, since he said he has two in stock. If so, then I'll do more shopping around before I order, on the chance I can get the part even cheaper and still be getting exactly the same thing. Thanks!

[Borbet225]

Not sure what's going on with your's, but a few year's ago my Duratec was throwing code's. My Auto X-ray 6000 scan tool showed a bad pre-heater circuit in one of the front O2 sensors, so replaced it. A few month's later the other side front sensor did the same thing, so may as well do em' both now. Got the sensor's from Oxygensensors.com, and were less than $40 buck's each. Also picked up they're special removal socket for $10 buck's. You're gonna need one of these, unless you can get at them with a box/open end wrench. Good luck with the repairs, as the one's on my Duratec, were a bear to get to.

[cherandy]

QUOTE (cherandy @ Mar 11 2010, 03:42 PM)

QUOTE (Jeff K @ Mar 11 2010, 03:37 PM)

I bet that if you open the Motorcraft box and pull out the O2 sensor and look at it, it will say Bosch somewhere on it, as Bosch makes the sensors for Ford for nearly all their "american" engines.[/b]

As for the Bosch thing... fascinating. I'll make another call to the dealership and ask him to tell me if it says Bosch on the part, since he said he has two in stock. If so, then I'll do more shopping around before I order, on the chance I can get the part even cheaper and still be getting exactly the same thing. Thanks!
[/b][/quote]

Just got off the phone with the parts guy at the local Ford dealership. I asked him nicely, and he pulled the part out of the (Motorcraft) box. He informs me that it is stamped with the Ford emblem and says "Made in USA" but that's it. No Bosch anywhere.

Hrm...